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Church 'hurt' - 7/28/2008 8:07:17 AM
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Proverbs31Wife
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Joined: 10/24/2005
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Yesterday our almost 14 year old son sat with our youth group at the front of the church. He sat beside a boy his age, who was sitting with his brother and the older youth. When we stood to sing and sat down again, the boy shoved his older brother over and moved half a seat away from our son.
We were sitting four rows behind, but it was very obvious. Our son didn't seem to notice and didn't mention anything, but he's seldom mentioned the mistreatment he has received in the 8 years we've been members. (Deacon's kids throwing things or calling him vulgar names...)
Our son is always clean and this year is well dressed (dressed like the other kids) because our older sons bought him brand named clothes at Christmas.
We are a poor family, but only in the last six or seven years. We are not able to go out to eat each week after church but have invited families home with us. As a couple or as a family, we are very active in our church.
Our son has never been invited to a birthday party through our church. He's been in Sunday School, VBS and AWANA with these same kids for most of his life. The kids go to five or six different schools, so that shouldn't be it. We home school, but until recently we've had a lot of home schooling families in our church.
Our son is tall, like the older boys. He's shy around the girls but has two or three friends in Youth group who come over and spend the day quite often. He is friendly and other than a few pimples once in a while, is quite nice looking.
The boy who shoved over comes from a well to do family that are part of the family who founded our church 200 years ago.
My husband and I work with our youth group and teach in that age group. We currently don't have a youth minister. I know, if I asked our son, he'd not want me to approach the parents.
Is this normal in youth groups? Any ideas on how to overcome this type situation?
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RE: Church 'hurt' - 7/28/2008 8:31:31 AM
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mvic
Posts: 890
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Bullying amongst children and teenagers is a problem which should be controlled and stopped by adults at schools, youth clubs etc ... Otherwise a bully can grow into adulthood thinking it is acceptable behaviour; and the bullied person can grow up with social and other difficulties in life.
That said: how do you deal with your situation?
The first thing I'd do is discuss it privately, and gently, with your son. Find out how long this has been going on. What does he feel about it. Is it a problem to him? Is it a threat, an annoynace, or does he just see it as friendly teasing amongst youngsters? There's nothing worse than a well-meaning parent interfering where a child does not want them to.
If possible, give examples of any bullying behaviour that happened to you when you were young. How did you or your parents deal with it? This will show your son that the bad behaviour isn't just aimed at him but it happens to others too - and others have dealt with it in the past.
If the problem is serious; at first discuss it, gently, with an elder in your church/youth group etc ... Someone in charge who can deal with the matter. Also, if possible, discuss it with the offending child's parents - but only after speaking to the church elders first.
Regarding your child's shyness: have you considered him joining a karate or judo club. Well organised clubs (here in the UK) teach youngsters that these are primarily self-defence techniques; they should never use the skills learnt as an offensive skill; and they sign a written oath not to do so. But most of all it improves their confidence no end.
I hope the above helps a little. Sorry about the long post.
And one final thing: don't forget to pray about this situation.
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RE: Church 'hurt' - 7/28/2008 12:13:58 PM
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deermousie
Posts: 1399
Joined: 9/26/2007
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Ohhh, yes. We went through this with our daughter. There was a large family whose kids were trying to divide and conquer all the other kids in our church: those they could bully and those they tried to sideline.
Our kid put up with being pushed, hit, getting dirt thrown in her face, being publically dishonored, having other kids told they couldn't play with her (two kids said "I'll have whatever friends I want" and continued being friends with our kid - yay for them!). I complained to my husband who brushed it off... until the kids started publically dissing him! Rude kids.
We went to the father, and he assured us he'd talk to his kids about it. He came back to us and informed us our kid was lying because his kids would never do that. Even though they were now doing it to both of us parents.
I couldn't go to the pastor for help because he was the pastor. He finally left our church (in disgrace, because it turns out his kids were doing this to everyone).
The upshot was: our daughter grew a strong and quiet spirit throughout all of this. She's far more compassionate and caring for others because she has suffered. She's also more careful how she treats others because she knows what it's like to hurt and be lonely. She also knows she can take some persecution and it won't kill her and she will come out fine in the end. It's part of what made her the godly woman she is today.
The pastor's family? Still bullying as far as I know. They invited her to join their facebook but they never talk to her so I guess they are counting scalps.
And me? I'm not going to bring charges in church and Christians don't sue each other (or we're not supposed to) and this isn't a criminal offense anyway, but I have to forgive them but not lie down in the driveway in front of them. I pray for them. Maybe those kids will grow up to be lawyers defending Christians or something like that that brings God glory. I'll trust Him for their lives, and know that God will make His servant stand and it's not my job. I took the Matt. 18 as far as I was willing, and so now I have to let it go.
And thank God for how He used this to shape my daughter's godliness. All things work together for good.
_____________________________
Want to know where a certain word or phrase in the Bible is found? www.biblegateway.com Yay!
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RE: Church 'hurt' - 7/28/2008 5:01:34 PM
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beachcooky
Posts: 602
Joined: 6/21/2008
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quote:
ORIGINAL: Proverbs31Wife
Yesterday our almost 14 year old son sat with our youth group at the front of the church. He sat beside a boy his age, who was sitting with his brother and the older youth. When we stood to sing and sat down again, the boy shoved his older brother over and moved half a seat away from our son.
We were sitting four rows behind, but it was very obvious. Our son didn't seem to notice and didn't mention anything, but he's seldom mentioned the mistreatment he has received in the 8 years we've been members. (Deacon's kids throwing things or calling him vulgar names...)
Our son is always clean and this year is well dressed (dressed like the other kids) because our older sons bought him brand named clothes at Christmas.
We are a poor family, but only in the last six or seven years. We are not able to go out to eat each week after church but have invited families home with us. As a couple or as a family, we are very active in our church.
Our son has never been invited to a birthday party through our church. He's been in Sunday School, VBS and AWANA with these same kids for most of his life. The kids go to five or six different schools, so that shouldn't be it. We home school, but until recently we've had a lot of home schooling families in our church.
Our son is tall, like the older boys. He's shy around the girls but has two or three friends in Youth group who come over and spend the day quite often. He is friendly and other than a few pimples once in a while, is quite nice looking.
The boy who shoved over comes from a well to do family that are part of the family who founded our church 200 years ago.
My husband and I work with our youth group and teach in that age group. We currently don't have a youth minister. I know, if I asked our son, he'd not want me to approach the parents.
Is this normal in youth groups? Any ideas on how to overcome this type situation?
My heart goes out to your son. I've been in that boat for my whole life, up to the age of 16.
A lot of humans are cruel. I guess that's why I just started not liking them because of the treatment that I used to get. I am thankful this no longer happens and I now have plenty of friends, who I love dearly.
But the sad part is, youth groups are a lot like that. My young adults (we combine young adults with youth group) isn't like that. But I know that it's very normal...and I know that some kids might feel left out because they don't belong. If I see a new comer at our youth and no one has approach him or her. I make an effort to go to them.
Your son doesn't deserve that. He must be hurting so much, and I'm sure he's happy to have parents like you, that love and care for him. I know when I was mistreated, I could always go to my mom about situations and she used to just sit there and talk to me about how much she loves me. My dad, he's a whole different story!
But anyways, talk to your son about it. Ask if it'll be ok if you talk to that boy's parents about it. Matthew 18 talks about that. How you can confront other Christians when somethings happened. God's going to be with you..and he's going to help you with whatever. Keep telling your son that Jesus loves him and that you love him.
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RE: Church 'hurt' - 7/28/2008 6:10:54 PM
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deermousie
Posts: 1399
Joined: 9/26/2007
Status: online
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quote:
ORIGINAL: beachcooky
If I see a new comer at our youth and no one has approach him or her. I make an effort to go to them.
Hats off to you, Beachcooky. Your pain has shaped you into a caring, decent Christian and human being, and God is glorified. You rock!
_____________________________
Want to know where a certain word or phrase in the Bible is found? www.biblegateway.com Yay!
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RE: Church 'hurt' - 7/28/2008 7:02:26 PM
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Liveloved
Posts: 1294
Joined: 1/22/2008
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quote:
Is this normal in youth groups? Any ideas on how to overcome this type situation?
Unfortunately your story is all too typical. The church is our sanctifying agent. Teach your son about Jesus, how Jesus responded to mistreatment, and your son will come out the stronger, wiser, more Christlike because of his experience.
Personally I have received more evil treatment from within the church than without. Does it grieve the heart of God? Absolutely.
But it causes us all to believe the gospel we preach all the more---we are indeed sinners in desperate need of a Savior and we have one in Jesus. Bless you! The life is all about overcoming, persevering, and pressing on. Sounds like you're living it.  LL
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RE: Church 'hurt' - 7/28/2008 7:35:55 PM
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BibleL7
Posts: 480
Joined: 2/1/2008
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I would say talk to your son about it first if it does not upset him then there is not really a problem. The incident as you described seems only to make the other boy to seem foolish and immature. Be sure your son knows he is loved by you and the Lord. Some times teens can be mean and foolish and many times quiet reserved teens dont get invited to participate in parties and such, sometimes that is not the worst thing. He may not want to associate with the other kids that are foolish as they tend to be kids that are just immature. I have seen some kids who attend public schools who thought home schooled kids are stuck up or not as good because of prejudice and not having school activities to talk about. And mostly in this situation I feel sorry for the kids going to public school cause the ones home-schooled are really neat kids.
I would suggest that if your son does not consider it a problem that you respect his opinion on the matter. Some times parents tend to see problems where kids dont. And as you say your son has some friends then that is good. A few friends that you get along with is something to cherish.
I was a quiet and shy boy and I did not have any close friends but then I did not go to church either. It is hard sometimes but then I did have mostly female friends in high school. Some times kids can handle things much better than parents think.
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RE: Church 'hurt' - 7/29/2008 8:31:36 AM
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jn1010lf
Posts: 228
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Hi Proverbs31Wife
I think it might be beneficial to examine the spiritual condition of the church you attend, at least the youth group. Churches that are on fire for Jesus are more concerned about reaching the lost and discipling their members than social class, popularity contests or whether or not one is well liked.
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RE: Church 'hurt' - 7/29/2008 10:04:32 AM
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HisFish
Posts: 529
Joined: 8/3/2005
From: Rocky mountain way
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While it is sad this kind of thing happens we shouldent be surprised because the kids who go to youth group are there because they have (hopefully) saved parents who attend, and with few exceptions they themselves are not saved (yet, hopefully).
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The theology of the present aims at the deification of man, but the truth of all time
magnifies God . C. H. Spurgeon
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RE: Church 'hurt' - 7/29/2008 1:17:24 PM
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rofaith
Posts: 26
Joined: 1/17/2008
From: rofaith, a believer
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Bullying is a huge problem... I was shocked in my experience to see it occur @ Evangelical Christian Schools and Church youth groups. I know of one young girl who was hurt similarly in and around 10-12 years old. She subsequently, of course, would not attend church at all. To this day as a young woman she remembers and that incident primed her for the indoctrination of the Public Schools and subsequently at the University level. Pray for her.... now that she is pregnant with her 1st child, I see a softening in her attitude... I've trusted her life into God's faithful hands...
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RE: Church 'hurt' - 7/29/2008 8:34:57 PM
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Zhi
Posts: 1117
Joined: 7/31/2007
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The youth group I grew up in had similar issues. Though at church they were "good little church kids", as soon as they were out the door the girls in our youth group were some of the most foul-mouthed and foul-minded people I have ever met in my entire life. And, since I was serious about Christianity, they pretty much tortured me in school and any other time they could get away with it.
I guess I would say to see if you can find other venues for your son to find Christian kids who ARE a good influence. It's nice and all to say that he will be stronger for it and all that, and true to some extent I guess, but the psychological and emotional scars from that are a very, very high price to pay. I still have to deal with my own at times.
This isn't to say leave the church, but there should be opportunities outside your church for his socialization.
_____________________________
The optimist says the glass is half full. The pessimist says the glass is half empty. The engineer says the glass is twice as large as it needs to be.
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RE: Church 'hurt' - 8/1/2008 7:18:25 PM
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Proverbs31Wife
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I posted this under an alternate username. My son saw me reading your replies and saw a remark about dirt being thrown, etc. He asked what the thread was about.
I told him, in a general way, what the thread was about and he remarked that stuff like that shouldn't go on.... especially at church. He didn't seem to have any idea it was my concern for him that started this thread.
Anyhow, our youth group has new kids coming in this week. My son is concerned about an older boy who has agreed to attend youth because the boy has a tiny girl like voice and is teased terribly at school. My son has spoken to a few of his church friends and asked them to welcome this older boy and not mention his voice (health problem). I overheard him just yesterday. I am blessed.
Thanks for the replies.
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RE: Church 'hurt' - 8/2/2008 8:44:45 AM
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buckifn
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at the age of 14 I believe your son is old enough to know how to be assertive in an approp. way when treated in a way he doesn't like.
Why not role play a few scenarios with him and give him some pointers on approp. responses? This approach let's him have choices on his response and doesn't leave him embarrassed that mom or dad is rescuing him in front of his peers.
Since he brought up the new boy who will be attending I would also role play some possible scenes involving him and show your son how to divert a negative back to a positive. There are many approp. ways to be assertive without being unChristlike. I believe we need to start teaching our kids this at a young age before they face it on the schoolgrounds, in youth group, and other places.
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RE: Church 'hurt' - 8/2/2008 8:09:19 PM
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slimon11
Posts: 141
Joined: 2/10/2008
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quote:
ORIGINAL: deermousie
The upshot was: our daughter grew a strong and quiet spirit throughout all of this. She's far more compassionate and caring for others because she has suffered. She's also more careful how she treats others because she knows what it's like to hurt and be lonely. She also knows she can take some persecution and it won't kill her and she will come out fine in the end. It's part of what made her the godly woman she is today.
Reading this made me happy, thanks for sharing about your daughter.
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