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When is a dress code dumb? - 9/2/2008 11:30:48 PM
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Jenny-Fair
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My own kids are homeschooled, but I know a lovely young lady who goes to the local high school (the same one I went to) and tonight she showed me the dress code in her student handbook. I was appalled at some of the items on the list.
You cannot wear solid colors two days in a row.
You cannot wear blue Converse sneakers.
You can't wear or have a Rosary.
You can't wear a shirt that has a picture of paint on it.
You can't wear your socks pulled up high if your shorts are long.
There are others. Some of them are sensible--shorts and skirts have to be at least as long as your fingertip reaches, etc. But most of them are apparently contrived to keep kids from dressing like others in their gang.
But, my question is, how does this help? If kids are in a gang, they are in a gang, regardless of what they wear. As you ban certain clothing items, they choose others, and you ban them too, now what we have is an entire school whose clothing choices are severely limited by a relatively small criminal element, and the teachers and admins are wasting their time trying to keep track of how many times Lisa has worn a plain t-shirt this week.
If a gang started carrying bibles (presumably the gang that is carrying Rosaries, but now Rosaries are banned) then they would ban them, too. If they started wearing 5-pocket Levis with belts then all the Mormon boys would have to change to baggy pants. If they started wearing veils, what would the poor Muslim girls do?
And, of course, while monitoring meaningless and superficial behavior, how can the adults in the school actually be worrying about important stuff? (like the two kids with the gun last year that they didn't do anything about for nearly two hours...but that's another post)
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RE: When is a dress code dumb? - 9/3/2008 12:24:49 AM
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OneOfHisJewels
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As dumb as that all may sound, most kids I've talked to that got to public high schools have told me that yes, there is a dress code, but it's never enforced......so it it's not even enforced, not to worry. I'm not bashing public schools..just saying that's what I've been told.
I personally think uniforms would make sense, then you don't have to get so nitty gritty with a dress code..after all schools see they make sense for p.e. class and sports teams...why not for school as well(not saying p.e. uniforms for the other part of the school day)
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RE: When is a dress code dumb? - 9/3/2008 1:00:42 AM
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Jenny-Fair
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According to my friend, Jossie, and this is her third year in this school, there are teachers who spend an inordinate amount of time finding dress code violations and sending kids to the office. Also, anyone whose tank top doesn't have wide enough straps or who breaks any other dress code has to wear an oversized t-shirt (although oversized t-shirts are against the dress code rules!) that says 'I am a dress-code violator' on the front in big letters.
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Tony: Ziva, did you kill Houdini?
Ziva: It is possible. I do not remember all their names.
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RE: When is a dress code dumb? - 9/3/2008 1:08:30 AM
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OneOfHisJewels
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Oy, they do things differently in Washington.
My christian high school made you wear a toga and a sign. That same high school has uniforms now. I always wished they had uniforms when I was there, because there were a lot of wealthy people that could afford clothes that put those of us who couldn't afford them on the out crowd.
I'm sorry your friend has to go through that.
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Now thank we all our God, with hearts and hands and voices, what wondrous things He's done, in whom the world rejoices.
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RE: When is a dress code dumb? - 9/3/2008 7:24:50 AM
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Sideways
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I understand that kids will be in a gang regardless of dress code, but I can appreciate the fact that school officials at least want to stop the kids from advertising the fact that they are in a gang at school. There will be less fights that way. Not every gang member will know every other gang member, so if they can't recognize each other at school, that lessens the tensions just a little bit.
Uniforms are the answer, in my opinion, although the rosary part is tricky. I don't like any student being denied the chance to express their religion, except for the gangs who are desecrating the rosary by using it as a gang symbol.
Ah, it's a tricky business, but I see both sides of it.
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RE: When is a dress code dumb? - 9/3/2008 9:34:25 AM
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Auben
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Perhaps your school thinks about 'gangs' in a different way then most public schools do. Usually public high schools create rules relating to national or regional gangs. Gangs so large that they can't really change their colors or styles for the school system. The intent is to keep people from being knifed because they wore the wrong hat or wrong shirt in front of a rival gang member.
In my opinion, it gets ridiculous when rules are no longer for the good of the students and there is no outlet or flexibility for people who make mistakes.
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RE: When is a dress code dumb? - 9/3/2008 9:43:46 AM
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Auben
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IMO, the rosary is completely ridiculous. For every person who uses it as a gang symbol you are punishing someone else who uses it as a sincere expression of faith. I doubt that rule would hold up in court. I don't know any major gangs that use it as a prominent symbol.
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RE: When is a dress code dumb? - 9/3/2008 11:07:04 AM
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GregandJenny
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quote:
You cannot wear solid colors two days in a row.
You cannot wear blue Converse sneakers.
You can't wear or have a Rosary.
All gang symbols.
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RE: When is a dress code dumb? - 9/3/2008 11:13:36 AM
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bluestone
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Wearing a gang's clothing will get you killed. I think these are probably rules for the safety of kids, not just to curtail gang advertising.
Our system has uniforms, the best thing they have ever done. Khaki pants or skirts, solid color polo shirts for boys and girls, with no large symbls on them. The parents even have an end of summer uniform swap, so money is saved.
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RE: When is a dress code dumb? - 9/3/2008 11:22:07 AM
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macokjc
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Uniforms would fix the problem, but from what I understand and have read, public schools can barely get parents to send in pencils. Good luck getting them to buy uniforms.
I don't think there is a rule out there that 100% of the people would agree with. No matter what, somebody is always going to think some rule is "dumb." I think it's a matter of teaching character in discussing with your child that while we don't always agree, our job is to obey.
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RE: When is a dress code dumb? - 9/3/2008 11:37:26 AM
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Jenny-Fair
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quote:
However, we do have one school in our area that bought pink jumpsuits for dress code violators to wear because they thought no kid would want to wear one. Wrong-o. The kids have been dressing inappropriately on purpose because the pink suits are considered "cool." Kids.
That was my first thought when Jossie told me about the t-shirts, and she admitted to already wishing she had one, lol.
quote:
Wearing a gang's clothing will get you killed.
Not here, or at least I highly doubt it. And my point is that if any group of kids decided to use, say, underwire bras as a gang symbol, then the rest of the student body would have to go unsupported. It's giving too much power to the gangs to allow them to choose what the rest of the students can wear.
I don't think uniforms would work well here. We have a very diverse selection of dedicated religious groups and I can think of some that would be unable to wear the school uniform.
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Tony: Ziva, did you kill Houdini?
Ziva: It is possible. I do not remember all their names.
My Blog
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RE: When is a dress code dumb? - 9/3/2008 11:42:39 AM
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GregandJenny
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^^^
I think you have a point with giving the "gangs" to much power. I think schools in general are trying to be more proactive. They hear Seattle or tacoma stories (usually blown out of proportion ) and they freak.
G
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RE: When is a dress code dumb? - 9/3/2008 11:46:54 AM
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Jenny-Fair
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Well, like I said earlier, this school doesn't deal with actual threats and problems, so it's disturbing that they would waste time and energy on a dress code that would have no real implications.
Also, the fingertip length thing rules out the cheerleader uniforms they had when I went there 16 years ago, lol.
_____________________________
Tony: Ziva, did you kill Houdini?
Ziva: It is possible. I do not remember all their names.
My Blog
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RE: When is a dress code dumb? - 9/3/2008 1:23:00 PM
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all4aremine
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This is the first year that the elementary school that my kids go to in a very small town went to specific dress code. Only allowed to wear solid polo shirts with no labels, and only wear khaki or denim pants with no more then 5 pockets-rules out the cargo pants. They have to fit snuggly on their hips and not show any undergarment.
The reason for our change is because of economical not gang related. 60% of the population where I live is on welfare so the polo shirts are cheaper then anything else and the 40% that can afford more then that don't look like they are better then any other child.
My church actually handed out 2 shirts and 2 pairs of pants to each child in the elementary school to get them started for this year.
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RE: When is a dress code dumb? - 9/3/2008 1:34:50 PM
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Jenny-Fair
Posts: 6284
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From: WA
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quote:
Only allowed to wear solid polo shirts with no labels
Required in your school, banned in ours.
_____________________________
Tony: Ziva, did you kill Houdini?
Ziva: It is possible. I do not remember all their names.
My Blog
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RE: When is a dress code dumb? - 9/4/2008 1:57:32 PM
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locomom
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I'm pretty sure that the school cannot legally prevent a student from having a rosary.
When your homeschool school says you can't wear tasteful chokers because they are a symbol of bondage. When your homeschool school requires polo shirts, then gets freaked out about v-neck polo shirts that are modest, but waits until the middle of the school year to do it. In the second case, the whole issue was modesty. When you can't wear a turtleneck because you're supposed to wear a polo shirt, but you can wear a turtleneck under a pullover sweater.
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RE: When is a dress code dumb? - 9/4/2008 10:48:04 PM
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momof4
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I really don't understand the "no solid colors 2 days in a row" rule! Who is able to really monitor that? I couldn't even tell you if I have worn solid colors 2 days in a row myself! There aren't a lot of prints out there right now for teenagers. I mean, they don't really wear much in the way of prints, or any non-solid colors. Once in a while they might wear a plaid shirt, but not every other day. It just seems like a crazy rule to me. If the gangs are so large that they don't even always know each other's members, how can they possibly keep track of someone wearing solid colors 2 days in a row? In thinking about the boys, esp, that I have seen, it seems like they really don't have that much that would not be solid colors. In thinking about my own 13 yr old dau's wardrobe, she doesn't have much in the way of prints, either. It would be a hard rule to follow.
She is in 8th grade this yr, her second yr in Jr Hi. All of her elementary yrs were in a school with uniforms, and we loved it. Now that she doesn't have uniforms anymore, it is harder to keep her dressed. I mean, she has to have more clothes. They only have one Jr Hi in this town with uniforms, and I don't think any of the Sr Hi's have them, but many of the grade schools do. She was glad to be done with uniforms, but we wish she still had them!
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RE: When is a dress code dumb? - 9/5/2008 8:28:23 AM
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edgibson
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quote:
ORIGINAL: Jenny-Fair
quote:
However, we do have one school in our area that bought pink jumpsuits for dress code violators to wear because they thought no kid would want to wear one. Wrong-o. The kids have been dressing inappropriately on purpose because the pink suits are considered "cool." Kids.
That was my first thought when Jossie told me about the t-shirts, and she admitted to already wishing she had one, lol.
quote:
Wearing a gang's clothing will get you killed.
Not here, or at least I highly doubt it. And my point is that if any group of kids decided to use, say, underwire bras as a gang symbol, then the rest of the student body would have to go unsupported. It's giving too much power to the gangs to allow them to choose what the rest of the students can wear.
I don't think uniforms would work well here. We have a very diverse selection of dedicated religious groups and I can think of some that would be unable to wear the school uniform.
Never assume. Most people in my little town have no idea the amount of gang activity that goes on in the schools. Elementary and middle school, not just high school.
In my experience, what seems to be a goofy dress code rule, was written in to cover a specific problem that has happened in the past.
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Chicago public schools have all gone to uniforms as far as I know. I think they look real nice. 
or turn our shirt inside out.
