RE: Iran not building nukes

RE: Iran not building nukes (Full Version)

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cow451 -> RE: Iran not building nukes (4/9/2008 10:34:30 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Jhud quote: With Iran Says It Tests Advanced Centrifuges and Iran starts installing new nuclear centrifuges, I'm sure there's no cause for concern. Might even be a translation problem... Pay no attention to the man behind the curtan.... As I've said before: We have nothing to threaten them with except harsh language. In fact, the US NEEDS Iran to help deal with the mess in Iraq.

EStan -> RE: Iran not building nukes (4/9/2008 11:34:18 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: cow451 quote: ORIGINAL: Jhud quote: With Iran Says It Tests Advanced Centrifuges and Iran starts installing new nuclear centrifuges, I'm sure there's no cause for concern. Might even be a translation problem... Pay no attention to the man behind the curtan.... As I've said before: We have nothing to threaten them with except harsh language. In fact, the US NEEDS Iran to help deal with the mess in Iraq. Exactly. We should just let 'em have their heavy-water reactors. In fact - a nice gift of a few hundred pounds of plutonium. But only if they promise to play nice and wash their hands before dinner.

cow451 -> RE: Iran not building nukes (4/9/2008 2:11:59 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: EStan quote: ORIGINAL: cow451 quote: ORIGINAL: Jhud quote: With Iran Says It Tests Advanced Centrifuges and Iran starts installing new nuclear centrifuges, I'm sure there's no cause for concern. Might even be a translation problem... Pay no attention to the man behind the curtan.... As I've said before: We have nothing to threaten them with except harsh language. In fact, the US NEEDS Iran to help deal with the mess in Iraq. Exactly. We should just let 'em have their heavy-water reactors. In fact - a nice gift of a few hundred pounds of plutonium. But only if they promise to play nice and wash their hands before dinner. And your suggestion based in reality is ................................................ er .................................... maybe our good friends the Russians could ..................... forget that ............ maybe the Chinese .................. or get the Israelis to drop a few bombs. Yeah, that's it. Oh, wait, we've got 150,000 soldiers in Iraq (next door to Iran, BTW). Gosh, how well things will go in Iraq if the Iranians open the arms floodgate to the Shiite militias. Great options, thanks to the neocon moron brain trust.

WesP -> RE: Iran not building nukes (4/9/2008 2:31:17 PM)
quote: Oh, wait, we've got 150,000 soldiers in Iraq (next door to Iran, BTW). Gosh, how well things will go in Iraq if the Iranians open the arms floodgate to the Shiite militias. Great options, thanks to the neocon moron brain trust. If it comes to a last resort, we will send Dead Eye Dick!

Jhud -> RE: Iran not building nukes (4/9/2008 2:52:03 PM)
quote: As I've said before: We have nothing to threaten them with except harsh language. In fact, the US NEEDS Iran to help deal with the mess in Iraq. Remind me, how is it we need them there again?

cow451 -> RE: Iran not building nukes (4/9/2008 2:57:39 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Jhud quote: As I've said before: We have nothing to threaten them with except harsh language. In fact, the US NEEDS Iran to help deal with the mess in Iraq. Remind me, how is it we need them there again? Because they have a fair amount of influence over several Shiite factions, specifically Sadr's militia. So Iran can help or they can put even more fuel on the flames.

WesP -> RE: Iran not building nukes (4/9/2008 3:00:18 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: cow451 quote: ORIGINAL: Jhud quote: As I've said before: We have nothing to threaten them with except harsh language. In fact, the US NEEDS Iran to help deal with the mess in Iraq. Remind me, how is it we need them there again? Because they have a fair amount of influence over several Shiite factions, specifically Sadr's militia. So Iran can help or they can put even more fuel on the flames. Regrettably, they continue to use the fuel to flames method.

cow451 -> RE: Iran not building nukes (4/9/2008 3:01:33 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: WesSavedByGrace quote: ORIGINAL: cow451 quote: ORIGINAL: Jhud quote: As I've said before: We have nothing to threaten them with except harsh language. In fact, the US NEEDS Iran to help deal with the mess in Iraq. Remind me, how is it we need them there again? Because they have a fair amount of influence over several Shiite factions, specifically Sadr's militia. So Iran can help or they can put even more fuel on the flames. Regrettably, they continue to use the fuel to flames method. Do you know the difference between a campfire and a forest fire?

stamper_ben -> RE: Iran not building nukes (4/9/2008 3:06:57 PM)
quote: Do you know the difference between a campfire and a forest fire? Unchecked either will turn into a conflagration.

WesP -> RE: Iran not building nukes (4/9/2008 3:06:58 PM)
quote: Do you know the difference between a campfire and a forest fire? No. Do tell! [8D]

WesP -> RE: Iran not building nukes (4/9/2008 3:08:27 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: stamper_ben quote: Do you know the difference between a campfire and a forest fire? Unchecked either will turn into a conflagration. Always ready with the wit, Ben! [sm=gradsmile.gif][sm=biggrin.gif]

stamper_ben -> RE: Iran not building nukes (4/9/2008 3:09:29 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: WesSavedByGrace quote: ORIGINAL: stamper_ben quote: Do you know the difference between a campfire and a forest fire? Unchecked either will turn into a conflagration. Always ready with the wit, Ben! [sm=gradsmile.gif][sm=biggrin.gif] I even spelled it right![8D]

Jhud -> RE: Iran not building nukes (4/9/2008 3:19:11 PM)
quote: Because they have a fair amount of influence over several Shiite factions, specifically Sadr's militia. So Iran can help or they can put even more fuel on the flames. Perhaps we could drop a few fire extinguishers on their fuel factories?

cow451 -> RE: Iran not building nukes (4/9/2008 3:38:39 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Jhud quote: Because they have a fair amount of influence over several Shiite factions, specifically Sadr's militia. So Iran can help or they can put even more fuel on the flames. Perhaps we could drop a few fire extinguishers on their fuel factories? There's a more earthy analogy, which I'll clean up for TOS. That would be like urinating on a forest fire.

Jhud -> RE: Iran not building nukes (4/9/2008 3:54:33 PM)
quote: There's a more earthy analogy, which I'll clean up for TOS. That would be like urinating on a forest fire. Well, for all the hot metaphors, I still fail to see how we might need them; we might have to deal with them in some manner, but tend to think we would do much better if they weren't a player at all.

cow451 -> RE: Iran not building nukes (4/9/2008 3:56:25 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Jhud quote: There's a more earthy analogy, which I'll clean up for TOS. That would be like urinating on a forest fire. Well, for all the hot metaphors, I still fail to see how we might need them; we might have to deal with them in some manner, but tend to think we would do much better if they weren't a player at all. They are a player and we cannot do anything to change that fact.

Jhud -> RE: Iran not building nukes (4/9/2008 4:01:53 PM)
quote: They are a player and we cannot do anything to change that fact. True, but we better do it with our eyes wide open; enough pretending they don't want nukes. I have to admit I am not sure what our leverage is at this point, other than "Knock it off if you want to live".

cow451 -> RE: Iran not building nukes (4/10/2008 12:53:55 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Jhud quote: They are a player and we cannot do anything to change that fact. True, but we better do it with our eyes wide open; enough pretending they don't want nukes. I have to admit I am not sure what our leverage is at this point, other than "Knock it off if you want to live". We've had to deal with other nuke nations. We just need to get over ourselves and take a dose of reality.

stamper_ben -> RE: Iran not building nukes (4/11/2008 9:53:56 AM)
quote: How to create deterrence? The way John Kennedy did during the Cuban missile crisis. President Bush�s greatest contribution to nuclear peace would be to issue the following declaration, adopting Kennedy�s language while changing the names of the miscreants: �It shall be the policy of this nation to regard any nuclear attack upon Israel by Iran, or originating in Iran, as an attack by Iran on the United States, requiring a full retaliatory response upon Iran.� This should be followed with a simple explanation: �As a beacon of tolerance and as leader of the free world, the United States will not permit a second Holocaust to be perpetrated upon the Jewish people.� From Charles Krauthammer. Worth the time to read the whole thing.

TheosCentric -> RE: Iran not building nukes (4/11/2008 10:09:38 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: stamper_ben quote: How to create deterrence? The way John Kennedy did during the Cuban missile crisis. President Bush�s greatest contribution to nuclear peace would be to issue the following declaration, adopting Kennedy�s language while changing the names of the miscreants: �It shall be the policy of this nation to regard any nuclear attack upon Israel by Iran, or originating in Iran, as an attack by Iran on the United States, requiring a full retaliatory response upon Iran.� This should be followed with a simple explanation: �As a beacon of tolerance and as leader of the free world, the United States will not permit a second Holocaust to be perpetrated upon the Jewish people.� From Charles Krauthammer. Worth the time to read the whole thing. point being?

stamper_ben -> RE: Iran not building nukes (4/11/2008 10:22:59 AM)
Point being - what is to be done? As with all other things in this world and life, one either takes a stand or not. Consequences result from that. Now with regard to Iran and nukes, what do you want the consequences to be?

Leon_Figg3 -> RE: Iran not building nukes (4/11/2008 10:25:28 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: cow451 quote: ORIGINAL: Jhud quote: As I've said before: We have nothing to threaten them with except harsh language. In fact, the US NEEDS Iran to help deal with the mess in Iraq. Remind me, how is it we need them there again? Because they have a fair amount of influence over several Shiite factions, specifically Sadr's militia. So Iran can help or they can put even more fuel on the flames. I thought that Sadr and his militia were nationalists and against any involvment in Iraq by any other country. I recently heard someone complain that instead of fighting Sadr and his militia, because of his stand against Iran and foreign intervention in Iraq, we should be supporting him more than the elected leaders in Iraq who seem to be heading for some sort of alliance, or working relationship with Iran. It seems to me that part of the problem in the Middle East, especially as far as Islam and politics is concerned, is the inability by anyone to keep straight who is. or isn't, working with whom and why, or why not, at any given time. Sorry for getting off topic, but I believe that the bottom line in the Middle East is that we in the West do not have a clue as to whom or what we should believe about what is going on in that region. We seem to be told one thing by a variety of spokes people in the Middle East, only to find out that the people there are told something different and that something else is accutually going on.

TheosCentric -> RE: Iran not building nukes (4/11/2008 10:37:07 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: stamper_ben Point being - what is to be done? As with all other things in this world and life, one either takes a stand or not. Consequences result from that. Now with regard to Iran and nukes, what do you want the consequences to be? What about Iran and nukes? NIE says they are not preparing them.

stamper_ben -> RE: Iran not building nukes (4/11/2008 10:57:09 AM)
No. The NIE said they were moderately confident that Iran has not restarted nuclear weaponization. If you're happy with that assessment that's on you. I'm not extremely confident of that moderate confidence that the zealous religious leaders of Iran aren't looking for nuclear weapons. From the article - quote: At home, the president�s efforts to stop Iran�s nuclear program were irreparably undermined by November�s National Intelligence Estimate, whose �moderate confidence� that Iran has not restarted nuclear weaponization � the least important of three elements of any nuclear program � has promoted the illusion that Iran has given up the pursuit of nuclear weapons. Yet uranium enrichment, the most difficult step, proceeds apace, as does the development of nuclear-capable ballistic missiles.

TheosCentric -> RE: Iran not building nukes (4/11/2008 11:06:53 AM)
Are you confident in the NIE assessment leading up to the Iraq War?

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