RE: Is it acceptable for Christian fam. to kick out adult son for refusing to goto church?
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Is it acceptable for Christian fam. to kick out adult son for refusing to goto church?
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Total Votes : 79
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(last vote on : 5/5/2008 12:34:43 PM)
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RE: Is it acceptable for Christian fam. to kick out adu... - 4/17/2008 7:23:06 PM
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9drtr
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quote:
ORIGINAL: Ps103
quote:
Where does this perogative end?
In my house, it does not end.
You honestly believe you have the right to break a contract at will?
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Edwin
When we know who is coming, how can we worry about what is coming? When the last hour belongs to us, how can we worry about the next minute?
Ross Crighton
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RE: Is it acceptable for Christian fam. to kick out adu... - 4/17/2008 7:24:09 PM
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SovereignIsHe
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quote:
ORIGINAL: qtman
We have all been quick to offer this young man opinions and advice. However, I have never seen a disagreement that did not have two sides. And as far as I can tell only one person has pointed out we have only heard one side.
What grounds would the parents have to change their mind and later enforce something that was already on the table? Given what I have seen posted on this thread his parents could call the person who has the loan on their car and tell them they are not happy with the deal they first made and they are going to pay $100 less for the remainder fo the loan and not be taken to task for it...
quote:
I'm sorry folks but laws and rules change.
The laws about Christians breaking agreements they make stand and do not change...
quote:
If someone can't handle this they have a lot to learn about life. Look at just about any credit card or contest agreement you have. Somewhere in the fine print it will probably say something to the effect "rules and conditions are subject to change without prior notice."
Apples and oranges.... The small print in the credit card was agreed upon by both parties prior. As for the OP... The question of going to church was discussed and not an issue at the time the agreement was made... If your credit card company came along and added something to what was agreed upon contract they could be taken to task over it...
quote:
So far the only thing I am sure of about this guy's beliefs is that he believes he will not go to church.
That and his parents have no understanding that they are beaking God's law by going back on their word...
quote:
There is no biblical basis that covers this situation at all that I am aware of. The owner of a house, in this case the mom and Step-dad can make, establish or change rules as they see fit.
No Biblical basis? Each and every covenant(agreements) made... Let your YES be yes and your No, be no… The fact that when one claims Christ they represent God and He's not the God of breaking covenants (agreements).
quote:
This a young man has a choice. Go along with the rules or leave.
To be fair it not a rule but more the whim of another person...
As well... The parents have a choice to act in a Christian manner by keeping their word. And in all honesty given they are the ones claiming Christ they should consider their own beam before making a big deal about who goes or doesn't go to church...
Given what is being allowed in regards to the OP his parents could hire a person to paint their house and later refuse to pay and be within their rights to do so; based on I'm sorry folks but laws and rules change.
John
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RE: Is it acceptable for Christian fam. to kick out adu... - 4/17/2008 7:35:15 PM
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SovereignIsHe
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quote:
ORIGINAL: zoebob
I don't think I would say she lied unless as soon as she moved in she said "oh, now I expect you to go to church" Maybe in the last several months she has been convicted that those in her household should go to church.
That conviction doesn't overide the agreement she made...
quote:
Unless there was something in writing that she would never require him to go to church she has the right to change the rules in her household.
Where in the bible is the word of a Christain only subject to what is put on paper?
So... If his mother gave only her word to the painter, and there wasn't a paper contract she could not pay and be within God's law?
John
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RE: Is it acceptable for Christian fam. to kick out adu... - 4/17/2008 7:36:39 PM
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9drtr
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quote:
ORIGINAL: Memaw.
I don't think this is so much about going to church or not, I think this is about changing ones mind and word.
The Mom agreed she would not make him go to church before he moved in, yet now she is putting the ultimatum to him.
How can one be convinced Christianity is the right way to go when they are seeing that a "Christians'" word can not be trusted?
If the OP's account of events is accurate, then he moved back on the condition that he not be required to attend church, and his mother agreed to that condition. Doing so, she voluntarily gave up her authority in this area, and her right to change her mind.
If the OP's account of events is accurate, the mother is a liar, and may be guilty of fraud.
Whether the OP's account of events is accurate or not, forcing someone into church is no way to lead him into the fold. If my mother had tried to force me into a church, I would not be a Christian now. If my mother had lied to me like this, I would not have moved out and exercised my right as a self-sustaining adult to never talk to her again.
It looks to me that the lot of you are so worked up over authority issues that you would rather see Zedd lost forever than hold his mother to her own promise.
No soul has ever been won for the Kingdom by lies; no soul has ever been won for the Kingdom by fraud.
_____________________________
Edwin
When we know who is coming, how can we worry about what is coming? When the last hour belongs to us, how can we worry about the next minute?
Ross Crighton
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RE: Is it acceptable for Christian fam. to kick out adu... - 4/17/2008 7:36:43 PM
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SovereignIsHe
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quote:
ORIGINAL: qtman
What Ellie-Mae said. I don't care if the parents are non-christians and made a rule he could not attend church. It is their house and they are entitled to do that. I would however, not be encouraging him to stay there and follow that rule. I would be telling him to move out and live on his own. Which is probably what he should do anyway.
Doing things under your roof doesn't remove the right and wrong... Where does this idea come from???
John
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RE: Is it acceptable for Christian fam. to kick out adu... - 4/17/2008 7:45:17 PM
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9drtr
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quote:
ORIGINAL: qtman
We have all been quick to offer this young man opinions and advice. However, I have never seen a disagreement that did not have two sides. And as far as I can tell only one person has pointed out we have only heard one side.
Now that I agree with. We have only heard one side. But the majority of posts have chosen not to pay the slightest heed to that side. Have half the posters even read the whole of the OP instead of just the title?
quote:
I'm sorry folks but laws and rules change. If someone can't handle this they have a lot to learn about life. Look at just about any credit card or contest agreement you have. Somewhere in the fine print it will probably say something to the effect "rules and conditions are subject to change without prior notice."
When discussing the situation prior to his moving in, did the OP's mother at any time say, "By the way, anything I say now should be disregarded because I'm a manipulating liar?" If so, then she does have a case.
quote:
There is no biblical basis that covers this situation at all that I am aware of. The owner of a house, in this case the mom and Step-dad can make, establish or change rules as they see fit. This a young man has a choice. Go along with the rules or leave.
If he is paying rent or room and board, he has another choice. He can go to the authorities and require that his parents live up to the law on evicting a tenant. I'm not sure what that means his jurisdiction, but it might make an amusing court case.
_____________________________
Edwin
When we know who is coming, how can we worry about what is coming? When the last hour belongs to us, how can we worry about the next minute?
Ross Crighton
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RE: Is it acceptable for Christian fam. to kick out adu... - 4/17/2008 8:27:39 PM
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relady
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quote:
Did your mom just find out that you aren't Christian or have a shift in beliefs? My parents didn't make me go to church until I told them that I'm ex-Christian. Yeah, like that's really going to change your mind in a positive way, LOL.
quote:
Can a loving Mother kick her son out on the street simply because he won't go to church? Not in my opinion. I can't imagine any mother doing that. But apparently a lot of parents out here don't have a problem with it. Which attitude just highlights what this young man most likely finds lacking in Christianity. Sadly.
quote:
It is also troubling to me that I get the sense of: It's OK for a Christian to break his word if he decides it's time to change the rules, especially if it's for a good reason like making someone go to church. I find this attitude intensely disturbing. Unfortunately, an inordinate amount of Christians exhibit it, which may be playing a major part in why our churches are losing their young adults.
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RE: Is it acceptable for Christian fam. to kick out adu... - 4/17/2008 8:32:29 PM
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9drtr
Posts: 1582
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From: Toronto the Good
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quote:
ORIGINAL: relady
quote:
Can a loving Mother kick her son out on the street simply because he won't go to church? Not in my opinion. I can't imagine any mother doing that. But apparently a lot of parents out here don't have a problem with it. Which attitude just highlights what this young man most likely finds lacking in Christianity. Sadly.
quote:
It is also troubling to me that I get the sense of: It's OK for a Christian to break his word if he decides it's time to change the rules, especially if it's for a good reason like making someone go to church. I find this attitude intensely disturbing. Unfortunately, an inordinate amount of Christians exhibit it, which may be playing a major part in why our churches are losing their young adults.
Mohandas Gandhi once said that he would have become a Christian if not for the Christians he met.
_____________________________
Edwin
When we know who is coming, how can we worry about what is coming? When the last hour belongs to us, how can we worry about the next minute?
Ross Crighton
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RE: Is it acceptable for Christian fam. to kick out adu... - 4/17/2008 8:41:08 PM
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SovereignIsHe
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quote:
ORIGINAL: 9drtr
quote:
ORIGINAL: relady
quote:
Can a loving Mother kick her son out on the street simply because he won't go to church? Not in my opinion. I can't imagine any mother doing that. But apparently a lot of parents out here don't have a problem with it. Which attitude just highlights what this young man most likely finds lacking in Christianity. Sadly.
quote:
It is also troubling to me that I get the sense of: It's OK for a Christian to break his word if he decides it's time to change the rules, especially if it's for a good reason like making someone go to church. I find this attitude intensely disturbing. Unfortunately, an inordinate amount of Christians exhibit it, which may be playing a major part in why our churches are losing their young adults.
Mohandas Gandhi once said that he would have become a Christian if not for the Christians he met.
I think the idols he loved so very dearly had more to do with it... :P
John
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RE: Is it acceptable for Christian fam. to kick out adu... - 4/17/2008 8:56:02 PM
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9drtr
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There was a time when he was young that he did not love idols so.
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Edwin
When we know who is coming, how can we worry about what is coming? When the last hour belongs to us, how can we worry about the next minute?
Ross Crighton
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RE: Is it acceptable for Christian fam. to kick out adu... - 4/17/2008 8:56:34 PM
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rcjames
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quote:
ORIGINAL: 9drtr
Mohandas Gandhi once said that he would have become a Christian if not for the Christians he met.
Well right now ole Gandhi is shovelling coal.
Thanks
RC
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Just a country Preacher's humble opinion
Read the first chapter of my latest book here;
http://www.deliveranceofsara.com
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RE: Is it acceptable for Christian fam. to kick out adu... - 4/17/2008 9:01:09 PM
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Qtman
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I don't know where some of you people get off. You are advising this young man to go against his parents(at least his mother). You are encouraging him to break one of the ten commandments. And all of this based on what information he decided to put in the op. You have no idea if that info is true or not and yet you are quick to jump on it and tell him his mother is wrong. Some of you have even stooped so low as to call his mother a liar.
I got a news flash for you. Anybody that comes to stay in my house, I don't care if it is family or just friends, they come under my rules. Bibically I am the head of my household. If you don't like it remove yourself from my household.
The young man made a recent post HERE that has shed a little more light on the subject. I am getting the feeling that we are dealing with nothing more than a rebellious lad that may just need the disipline.
Whatever is happening please stop calling his mother a liar with no more to go on than what he has said.
< Message edited by zoebob -- 4/17/2008 9:07:25 PM >
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RE: Is it acceptable for Christian fam. to kick out adu... - 4/17/2008 9:07:39 PM
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car2ner
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I do find that young adults tend to think they know more than they do and it sometimes comes across as a "snotty attitude". I know at 19 I thought I knew so much... wow, was I wrong!
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RE: Is it acceptable for Christian fam. to kick out adu... - 4/17/2008 9:16:25 PM
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9drtr
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I wrote that if the information in the OP is accurate, then his mother is a liar. I stand by that, and will until the day I day. Read the words, not what you want them to say.
He may well be nothing more than "a rebellious lad that may just need the disipline." (sic) I have never disputed that. I have disputed the wisdom of trying to coerce someone into church.
I have given him no advice, merely commented on the posts in this thread.
_____________________________
Edwin
When we know who is coming, how can we worry about what is coming? When the last hour belongs to us, how can we worry about the next minute?
Ross Crighton
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RE: Is it acceptable for Christian fam. to kick out adu... - 4/17/2008 9:19:23 PM
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sjd2008
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quote:
ORIGINAL: qtman
The young man made a recent post HERE that has shed a little more light on the subject. I am getting the feeling that we are dealing with nothing more than a rebellious lad that may just need the disipline.
Actually, I'm getting the feeling that there has been some issues in Zedd's home that are unresolved.
Zedd does have to grow up.
Zedd's mother has got to allow him to grow. Witnessing doesn't mean ramming church down people's throats.
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RE: Is it acceptable for Christian fam. to kick out adu... - 4/17/2008 9:21:30 PM
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Qtman
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quote:
ORIGINAL: 9drtr
I wrote that if the information in the OP is accurate, then his mother is a liar. I stand by that, and will until the day I day. Read the words, not what you want them to say.
He may well be nothing more than "a rebellious lad that may just need the disipline." (sic) I have never disputed that. I have disputed the wisdom of trying to coerce someone into church.
I have given him no advice, merely commented on the posts in this thread.
I do not remember saying you said anything. The term liar was used more than once. I do tend to read what is written and not what I want it to say. All I can say is the guilty dog barks first and loudest. If the shoe fits wear it if not then the statement was probably not addressed to you.
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RE: Is it acceptable for Christian fam. to kick out adu... - 4/17/2008 9:22:34 PM
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sjd2008
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quote:
ORIGINAL: car2ner
I do find that young adults tend to think they know more than they do and it sometimes comes across as a "snotty attitude". I know at 19 I thought I knew so much... wow, was I wrong!
It's part of the growing process. It takes more courage to admit that you don't know what you don't know. That's when you gain maturity.
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RE: Is it acceptable for Christian fam. to kick out adu... - 4/17/2008 9:23:15 PM
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9drtr
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quote:
ORIGINAL: rcjames
quote:
ORIGINAL: 9drtr
Mohandas Gandhi once said that he would have become a Christian if not for the Christians he met.
Well right now ole Gandhi is shovelling coal.
Thanks
RC
I find it disturbing that you seem to take glee in that.
_____________________________
Edwin
When we know who is coming, how can we worry about what is coming? When the last hour belongs to us, how can we worry about the next minute?
Ross Crighton
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RE: Is it acceptable for Christian fam. to kick out adu... - 4/17/2008 9:25:16 PM
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9drtr
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quote:
ORIGINAL: qtman
quote:
ORIGINAL: 9drtr
I wrote that if the information in the OP is accurate, then his mother is a liar. I stand by that, and will until the day I day. Read the words, not what you want them to say.
He may well be nothing more than "a rebellious lad that may just need the disipline." (sic) I have never disputed that. I have disputed the wisdom of trying to coerce someone into church.
I have given him no advice, merely commented on the posts in this thread.
I do not remember saying you said anything. The term liar was used more than once. I do tend to read what is written and not what I want it to say. All I can say is the guilty dog barks first and loudest. If the shoe fits wear it if not then the statement was probably not addressed to you.
I have more than once been accused in one forum or another of writing things I had not written. I'm sorry for my overreaction.
_____________________________
Edwin
When we know who is coming, how can we worry about what is coming? When the last hour belongs to us, how can we worry about the next minute?
Ross Crighton
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RE: Is it acceptable for Christian fam. to kick out adu... - 4/17/2008 9:36:13 PM
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Qtman
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You may be surprised to know I have often agreed with your posts. Just not the ones on this thread. And even here you may be right I just don't think we have enough information to base an opinion on and I don't like to tell some one that "if" this statement is true then the answer is.......
That just sond to much like a computer programming function. And in fact it is. It's called the if/then/else statement in programming.
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RE: Is it acceptable for Christian fam. to kick out adu... - 4/17/2008 9:38:34 PM
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SovereignIsHe
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quote:
ORIGINAL: qtman
I don't know where some of you people get off. You are advising this young man to go against his parents(at least his mother). You are encouraging him to break one of the ten commandments. And all of this based on what information he decided to put in the op. You have no idea if that info is true or not and yet you are quick to jump on it and tell him his mother is wrong. Some of you have even stooped so low as to call his mother a liar.
A Christian going back on their word is breaking God's law... And in the big picture who is held more accountable? The parent claiming Christ or the child who doesn't not going to church?
Since it's a sin to go back on your word how can one advise Zedd to go along with his mom's actions?
quote:
I got a news flash for you. Anybody that comes to stay in my house, I don't care if it is family or just friends, they come under my rules. Bibically I am the head of my household. If you don't like it remove yourself from my household.
That's fine... You stated up front how things are... Your yes is yes and your no is no...
quote:
The young man made a recent post HERE that has shed a little more light on the subject. I am getting the feeling that we are dealing with nothing more than a rebellious lad that may just need the disipline.
His rebellious attitude doesn't absolve the actions of his mother...
quote:
Whatever is happening please stop calling his mother a liar with no more to go on than what he has said.
IF she went back on her word she is wrong... It's that plain and simple... No matter what Zedd posts or doesn't...
John
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RE: Is it acceptable for Christian fam. to kick out adu... - 4/17/2008 9:40:07 PM
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9drtr
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quote:
ORIGINAL: qtman
You may be surprised to know I have often agreed with your posts.
Why should that surprise me? 
We'll have to agree to disagree on if...then issues.
Actually, I agree with you better than 90% of the time.
< Message edited by 9drtr -- 4/17/2008 9:47:31 PM >
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Edwin
When we know who is coming, how can we worry about what is coming? When the last hour belongs to us, how can we worry about the next minute?
Ross Crighton
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I thinks it ironic that the person who doesn't care to go to church sees that it's wrong... 
