RE: Should Christian Entertainers Have High Moral Standards? (RE: Miley Cyrus and Others)
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RE: Should Christian Entertainers Have High Moral Stand... - 5/2/2008 5:04:24 PM
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OneOfHisJewels
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quote:
ORIGINAL: zoebob
I guess some of us don't understand how a girl who is topless except for a bedsheet clutched to her chest isn't sexy/sensual.
That image suggests one of two scenerios: Either she sleeps in the nude and just woke up/going to bed, or she is trying to appear sexy. Both of those portray sexual innuendo...why else would you show someone getting ready for bed/getting up...especially if they are nude
Oh, yeah, I totally agree that THAT picture is sensuous/inappropriate, but I just don't think the father/daughter one was so bad like everyone thought.
< Message edited by OneOfHisJewels -- 5/2/2008 8:46:31 PM >
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RE: Should Christian Entertainers Have High Moral Stand... - 5/2/2008 8:11:25 PM
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sjd2008
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quote:
ORIGINAL: KatMack
sjd and csl, would I be correct in guessing that y'all are women? I'm guessing that because I bet you would be hard-pressed to find any male over the age of 11 that wouldn't see those images as being quite sensual.
--Kat
Sorry Kat, I am male and well over 11. Don't find the photos sensual in the least. Like QT I see a child, one that is vulnerable, but definitely a child.
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RE: Should Christian Entertainers Have High Moral Stand... - 5/2/2008 8:36:50 PM
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SovereignIsHe
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quote:
ORIGINAL: sjd2008
quote:
ORIGINAL: WesSavedByGrace
quote:
The photos were not for ads
I understand that, and it is irrelevant. My point was that media has run with the entire "sex sells" agenda, and you can say that is not correct all you want. The truth is that modesty is a dying trait in today's society, and it is to the detriment of our children.
I never said that sex doesn't sell. It very much does. However, it only sells if the person perceives the image as sexy, sensual, or whatever. I don't think that you're getting my point. I don't find the photos sexy ,sensual or immodest. That's where we disagree.
I don't disagree with your premise. I just don't agree with your opinion about the photos.
The viewer dictates content?
John
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RE: Should Christian Entertainers Have High Moral Stand... - 5/2/2008 8:39:45 PM
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SovereignIsHe
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On what planet is the bare back of a woman not sensual? I can't help but laugh at all this...
John
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RE: Should Christian Entertainers Have High Moral Stand... - 5/2/2008 8:48:10 PM
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sjd2008
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quote:
ORIGINAL: SovereignIsHe
On what planet is the bare back of a woman not sensual? I can't help but laugh at all this...
John
Sorry, I don't find the bare back of a 15 year old female sensual.
< Message edited by sjd2008 -- 5/2/2008 8:58:03 PM >
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RE: Should Christian Entertainers Have High Moral Stand... - 5/2/2008 8:51:35 PM
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sjd2008
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quote:
ORIGINAL: SovereignIsHe
The viewer dictates content?
John
Opinion on content.
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RE: Should Christian Entertainers Have High Moral Stand... - 5/2/2008 9:18:09 PM
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Qtman
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quote:
ORIGINAL: sjd2008
quote:
ORIGINAL: SovereignIsHe
On what planet is the bare back of a woman not sensual? I can't help but laugh at all this...
John
Sorry, I don't find the bare back of a 15 year old female sensual.
SJD I agree. THis is not a woman but a girl. Now would someone explain to this old codger exactly what about a bare back of a woman is sensual. I just don't get it. I have a wife, two daughters and two grand daughters. I have seen plenty of "bare back" at least as much as the Cyrus girl was showing and I find nothing sensual about it. Am I sick or is..............
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RE: Should Christian Entertainers Have High Moral Stand... - 5/2/2008 9:34:23 PM
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Qtman
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I don't know the reason for low backed dresses. If you find is sensual just say you find it sensual don't imply that we all do. I for one don't.
And I don't know of a post that I have made that stated otherwise.
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RE: Should Christian Entertainers Have High Moral Stand... - 5/2/2008 9:36:53 PM
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SovereignIsHe
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quote:
ORIGINAL: Qtman
I don't know the reason for low backed dresses. If you find is sensual just say you find it sensual don't imply that we all do. I for one don't.
I get the feeling if this thread continues will read that there is nothing sensual about women...
John
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RE: Should Christian Entertainers Have High Moral Stand... - 5/2/2008 9:44:42 PM
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Qtman
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quote:
ORIGINAL: SovereignIsHe
quote:
ORIGINAL: Qtman
I don't know the reason for low backed dresses. If you find is sensual just say you find it sensual don't imply that we all do. I for one don't.
I get the feeling if this thread continues will read that there is nothing sensual about women...
John
I didn't say that. You know it may just be the times. There was a time when a bare back would have been considered sensual. There was also a time when a ladies legs at least anything above the ankle was sensual. Maybe I have just seen so much skin that not much is sensual anymore. Sorta like drinking. When a person has their first deink it don't take muc to make them drunk bt the longer they drink the more it takes. I don't know where the medium is and don't think we will ever find it.
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RE: Should Christian Entertainers Have High Moral Stand... - 5/2/2008 10:21:38 PM
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Prairiehiker
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Just to get back on topic, I don't believe for once that everyone that calls themselves Christian is a Christ follower. People refer to themselves as Christian because it's the religion that they've been brought up in. You will find a lot of non Christians in church that claims they are, but their lives doesn't show any evidence that they are. So, I don't take the label seriously.
As for MIley, I love that kid. My kid loves that kid. She's a kid. That picture was meant to test the waters to see if people will accept her as a a maturing girl...you know, the "not a girl, not yet a woman" category. It makes money. She'll eventually evolve and who knows what she'll be like. At this point, she's too controlled by everyone around her that she most likely doesn't have much of a clue what's happening to her. I hope she has some good people around her.
By the way, Jessica Simpson and Britney Spears claimed to be Christians at one point. And let's not look in the entertainment business for people who didn't live out their faith. Just look at our fallen evangelist. If they can't be expected do what they preach, who can?
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RE: Should Christian Entertainers Have High Moral Stand... - 5/3/2008 3:14:06 PM
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figmentPez
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quote:
ORIGINAL: sjd2008
Sorry, I don't find the bare back of a 15 year old female sensual.
Kudos to you, but that isn't the point. There are men who, at least claim to, not find Playboy to be sensual, that doesn't change the intent of the publication, which is to be sexual and incite lust.
Let me ask you, if a 26 year-old woman were in the exact same pose, would you consider that sensual? Would you have any doubts as to what message the photo were trying to send if the female in the photo were of an age you find appealing?
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RE: Should Christian Entertainers Have High Moral Stand... - 5/3/2008 3:59:18 PM
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Qtman
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I don't know about sdj but you can put any female you wish in that picture and it will not be sensual to me. I don't get anymore excited over shoulder blades than I do elbows.
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RE: Should Christian Entertainers Have High Moral Stand... - 5/3/2008 8:47:08 PM
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gaylel1
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Let me ask all of you this--if Miley Cyrus was your daughter who done this kind of thing, would you be outraged at the photos? I becha of course some of you would because you would be protesting and calling the various talk shows showing your outrage of this.
I'm really suprized that the Christian community is not taking a stand on this, given some of the opinion thinking that she or her parents should not be judged because of what she did. And I do understand that.
But my concern is that if a girl see these pictures, she would say, "Well if Miley did it, I can do it too." So in other words, the girl would have given licence to sin w/o the consequences. I believe that what Miley and her parents were led to thinking. You see, when you are in the faith especially, there are consequenses to actions, and especially for bibical christians.
As a result of this though, I think it will be a backlash aganist her and Disney especially because people with moral values do not do this stuff. Miley just got caught because she felt that she can be tempted, but she has to live with the consequence.
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RE: Should Christian Entertainers Have High Moral Stand... - 5/3/2008 9:32:17 PM
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sjd2008
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quote:
ORIGINAL: figmentPez
quote:
ORIGINAL: sjd2008
Sorry, I don't find the bare back of a 15 year old female sensual.
Kudos to you, but that isn't the point. There are men who, at least claim to, not find Playboy to be sensual, that doesn't change the intent of the publication, which is to be sexual and incite lust.
Let me ask you, if a 26 year-old woman were in the exact same pose, would you consider that sensual? Would you have any doubts as to what message the photo were trying to send if the female in the photo were of an age you find appealing?
I honestly don't find bare backs to be sensual. What I've been trying to say all along is that not all men are attracted to the same features. The assumption that all men like the same features of a woman is part of the issue here. What one man likes another finds ho-hum. I don't find Mylie's pose to be sensual either. When I look at the image I see a vulnerable, scared girl. I don't find that at all to be sensual.
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RE: Should Christian Entertainers Have High Moral Stand... - 5/3/2008 9:38:53 PM
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Qtman
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quote:
ORIGINAL: sjd2008
quote:
ORIGINAL: figmentPez
quote:
ORIGINAL: sjd2008
Sorry, I don't find the bare back of a 15 year old female sensual.
Kudos to you, but that isn't the point. There are men who, at least claim to, not find Playboy to be sensual, that doesn't change the intent of the publication, which is to be sexual and incite lust.
Let me ask you, if a 26 year-old woman were in the exact same pose, would you consider that sensual? Would you have any doubts as to what message the photo were trying to send if the female in the photo were of an age you find appealing?
I honestly don't find bare backs to be sensual. What I've been trying to say all along is that not all men are attracted to the same features. The assumption that all men like the same features of a woman is part of the issue here. What one man likes another finds ho-hum. I don't find Mylie's pose to be sensual either. When I look at the image I see a vulnerable, scared girl. I don't find that at all to be sensual.
Letsface it dude you and I are weird. But I am satisfied that way.
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RE: Should Christian Entertainers Have High Moral Stand... - 5/3/2008 10:15:54 PM
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sjd2008
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quote:
ORIGINAL: gaylel1
Let me ask all of you this--if Miley Cyrus was your daughter who done this kind of thing, would you be outraged at the photos? I becha of course some of you would because you would be protesting and calling the various talk shows showing your outrage of this.
I'm really suprized that the Christian community is not taking a stand on this, given some of the opinion thinking that she or her parents should not be judged because of what she did. And I do understand that.
But my concern is that if a girl see these pictures, she would say, "Well if Miley did it, I can do it too." So in other words, the girl would have given licence to sin w/o the consequences. I believe that what Miley and her parents were led to thinking. You see, when you are in the faith especially, there are consequenses to actions, and especially for bibical christians.
As a result of this though, I think it will be a backlash aganist her and Disney especially because people with moral values do not do this stuff. Miley just got caught because she felt that she can be tempted, but she has to live with the consequence.
First, if I had a 15 year old daughter, I would have no problem with her posing like that.
I work in a High School. What some of these girls wear to the school makes Miley look like a nun. So, I don't think that many will see Miley's photos as permission to do much of anything.
As I have said before. Miley can't be Hannah Montana forever. At some point she has to make a break and change her career path. I suspect that a lot of the comments coming from Disney have the same validity of the famous Claude Rains line from Casablanca "I'm shocked, shocked to find gambling going on here". IOW, I suspect that everyone involved knew that the photos would be edgy. Annie Liebowitz is well known in photography and publishing circles for doing unique work that is "out there".
I don't however, see her going down the same path as Britney.Unlike Britney, her family is already involved in the music industry and is already used to the money and fame that it brings. Britney on the other hand, did not come from a show biz family therefore, neither her not her family wre ready for the shock of being a star.
Finally, I really don't believe that she has committed a sin. I realize that some of you are scandalized by what she has done and really don't agree with me. That is fine. IMHO, what she is guilty of is shocking the sensibilities of some of her fans and I'm not so sure that is a sin. I also realize that some of you feel that the pose is sensual or has sexual overtones. Whatever the original intent of the photographer was we really don't know. No one has quoted the photographer as saying that her message was to sexualize a 15 year old girl. So, as a result the best that we can do is guess at her intentions. For those of you who say that "all you need to do is look at the photo and you'll see her intention." I heartily disagree. When someone looks at an image they look at the image through the filter of their own experiences, prejudices, and views. What you see may NOT be what the artist/photographer wanted to communicate. Actually, I have seen that almost identical pose in several different works dating back several hundred years. It is considered a classic pose.
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RE: Should Christian Entertainers Have High Moral Stand... - 5/3/2008 10:24:56 PM
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sjd2008
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quote:
ORIGINAL: Qtman
Letsface it dude you and I are weird. But I am satisfied that way.
I am very satisfied as well.IMHO, the most sensual part of a woman is her eyes. I am also attracted to intelligent women as well. Not that anyone cares. 
< Message edited by sjd2008 -- 5/3/2008 10:33:26 PM >
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RE: Should Christian Entertainers Have High Moral Stand... - 5/3/2008 10:59:41 PM
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Memaw.
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quote:
As a result of this though, I think it will be a backlash aganist her and Disney especially because people with moral values do not do this stuff.
Gayle,
I find this statement to be offensive.
Is this what you meant to say?
Are you saying that anyone who has posed in this same pose does not hold any moral values?
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