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RE: Global warming- do you know the truth? - 5/8/2008 9:32:56 PM
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1dblthnk02
Posts: 395
Joined: 3/24/2008
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quote:
ORIGINAL: Bettawrekonize
Disagreeing with you and being intolerant of your view points are two different things.
True. I am not complaining so much about personal intolerance as to the general intolerance of the notion that global warming may actually be a reality in spite of Al Gore.
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So? Whether or not your skepticism is satisfied has no barring on the truth of the matter.
That's not what we were talking about here. I was responding to your scoffing at the idea of holding to two positions at once. I originally held the opinion that there was not enough evidence to support global warming. In spite of this fact, I decided to look into it further: I didn't really accept global warming, but I didn't prejudicially reject opposing arguments without at least giving them a modicum of consideration first.
In effect, I held to two opposing positions until I made up my mind.
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When you say things like, "I merely siad that I am right-- period." this suggests you aren't interested in listening to opposing views and criticisms.
How can you say that when I have been answering everyone's opposing views all along? I have to listen in order to respond, don't I?
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You seem to insist you are right no matter what.
No. I was wrong at first. If I was "right no matter what," then there would have been no intellectual quandry on my part concerning global warming.
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Truth is not based on what you proclaim and you can't expect critics of your views to take you seriously when you suggest otherwise.
I don't. Even if I didn't make these kinds of comments, I would not be taken seriously anyway. So, what does it matter?
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This perception you seem to have that you are superior at discerning truth (by method of proclamation) seems to give you an excuse not to tolerate opposing views
I don't need an excuse. I truly believe that I am right, and that truth is truth. Does truth need an excuse?
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after all, if you are right, why should you care what those opposing views are (and why should you care to tolerate them)?
Because I like to point out people's erroneous perceptions.
I mean, I could just stay off the forum and not respond to their disinformation; but, what fun would that be?
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So anyone who disagrees with you is dogmatic? Wow, that sounds rather .... dogmatic.
Not me personally.
Conservative websites disagree with Al Gore; therefore, they need not deal with the scientific merits of global warming. Instead they seek only to discredit Al Gore. Making the whole issue about Al Gore is ad hominem: the most intellectually lazy and irresponsible form of rebuttal that there is.
< Message edited by 1dblthnk02 -- 5/8/2008 9:40:27 PM >
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RE: Global warming- do you know the truth? - 5/8/2008 9:54:06 PM
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Bettawrekonize
Posts: 1073
Joined: 4/17/2005
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quote:
ORIGINAL: 1dblthnk02
True. I am not complaining so much about personal intolerance as to the general intolerance of the notion that global warming may actually be a reality in spite of Al Gore.
Again, you seem to be confusing intolerance with disagreement.
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In effect, I held to two opposing positions until I made up my mind.
You were undecided until your mind was made up. However, whatever you choose to believe has no bearing on truth. Your personal history on when you believed what is not an argument or evidence for or against global warming.
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How can you say that when I have been answering everyone's opposing views all along? I have to listen in order to respond, don't I?
Only to insist that you are right by method of proclamation.
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No. I was wrong at first. If I was "right no matter what," then there would have been no intellectual quandry on my part concerning global warming.
You seem to be suggesting that you are right and everyone is wrong just because they may disagree with you.
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I don't. Even if I didn't make these kinds of comments, I would not be taken seriously anyway. So, what does it matter?
You should still not make such comments. Insisting you are right by method of proclamation is not good argumentation.
There are other things that are required for people to take you seriously. You must present reasonable arguments. Statements like, "I am right" are not reasonable arguments.
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I don't need an excuse. I truly believe that I am right, and that truth is truth. Does truth need an excuse?
Likewise, someone who disagrees with you can say, "I truly believe that I am right, and that truth is truth. Does truth need an excuse?" Again, you want people to take you seriously, you need more than this, "This is true because I believe it" attitude.
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Because I like to point out people's erroneous perceptions.
I mean, I could just stay off the forum and not respond to their disinformation; but, what fun would that be?
Even if you are right, saying "your wrong and I'm right" is not pointing out their erroneous perceptions and you can't expect others to take you seriously if this is the best you can do.
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Conservative websites disagree with Al Gore; therefore, they need not deal with the scientific merits of global warming.
Just because they disagree with Al Gore does not mean they are not dealing with the scientific merits of the issue.
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Instead they seek only to discredit Al Gore. Making the whole issue about Al Gore is ad hominem: the most intellectually lazy and irresponsible form of rebuttal that there is.
Just because they disagree with Al Gore and they may point out counterarguments to his position does not mean they are intellectually lazy. Giving people who disagree with you negative labels and saying, "this is true because I proclaim it" suggests intolerance. You are free to disagree with others but if you are going to be intolerant of those who disagree with you by giving them derogatory labels (ie: intellectually lazy) and when your best arguments against those who disagree with you are, "I'm right," you can't expect others to take you seriously.
< Message edited by Bettawrekonize -- 5/8/2008 10:05:48 PM >
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RE: Global warming- do you know the truth? - 5/8/2008 10:13:36 PM
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StephK
Posts: 1525
Joined: 4/11/2005
From: Southwest Louisiana
Status: offline
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quote:
ORIGINAL: 1dblthnk02
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ORIGINAL: StephK
The fear mongers only see evil mankind, make that evil, capitalist US mankind as the culprit
This is a crock. Every site I have alluded to blames the vast majority of CO2 output on the countries that have the most burning due to deforestation: South & Central Americas, Africa, and Asia. The U.S. is not directly responsible for what these countries are doing, although we do have a hand in it indirectly.
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when history has shown that the climate changed without our assistance.
That was then; this is now. Things are different today than they were before mankind appeared on the scene.
I've seen it on liberal sites and with the liberals that I interact with. I can set my sister and BIL off so quickly just by mentioning Dubya. quote:
They suffer greatly from BDS.
BDS?
The US is being asked to foot the bill for the world pollution. That is why Kyoto was not signed. We would be forced to pay more than we are responsible for and we shouldn't have to do so.
I just watched a program on the Science Channel on how the Rocky Mountains are being eroded by the melting glaciers and the geologists stated that this is a cycle that has been going on for eons and not from global warming. There are many similar programs stating the same thing for the most part. The climate changes and has been since the dawn of time. Nothing you or I do will stop it either. Mankind is really just a speck of dust in comparison to the real forces of nature.
BDS = Bush Derangement Syndrome.
_____________________________
Stephanie
"If one starts with an impersonal beginning, the answer to morals eventually turns out to be the assertion that there are no morals." ~Francis Schaeffer
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RE: Global warming- do you know the truth? - 5/8/2008 10:16:40 PM
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1dblthnk02
Posts: 395
Joined: 3/24/2008
Status: offline
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quote:
ORIGINAL: Bettawrekonize
Again, you seem to be confusing intolerance with disagreement.
You know, I don't even really care anymore. This whole intolerance/disagreement thing is starting to bore me silly.
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You were undecided until your mind was made up.
No, my mind was made up prejudicially. I didn't accept the whole global warming theory. But, I took a fuller look at the evidence anyway just to be sure.
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However, whatever you choose to believe has no bearing on truth.
The truth has bearing on what I choose to believe. I don't tend to believe things that are patently untrue. True believers do that, but I don't.
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Your personal history on when you believed what is not an argument or evidence for or against global warming.
Wasn't meant to be. It is evidence that one can be of a certain conviction and still look at the other side with an open mind.
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Only to insist that you are right by method of proclamation.
I am able to shoot down everyone's arguments. What does that show you?
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You seem to be suggesting that you are right and everyone is wrong just because they may disagree with you.
Can we get beyond this, please? The Jedi Mind Trick, i.e. continuous autosuggestion, does not work on me.
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You should still not make such comments. Insisting you are right by method of proclamation is not good argumentation.
If I have nothing to back it up, then it is not good argumentation.
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There are other things that are required for people to take you seriously. You must present reasonable arguments. Statements like, "I am right" are not reasonable arguments.
Again, I have said a good deal more than that. You kep honing in on it hoping to redirect the thread from what else I have said.
It's obvious.
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Again, you want people to take you seriously, you need more than this, "This is true because I believe it" attitude.
I don't care if people take me seriously. I'm not running for public office.
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Even if you are right, saying "your wrong and I'm right" is not pointing out their erroneous perceptions and you can't expect others to take you seriously if this is the best you can do.
It isn't the best I can do, and we both know it. You keep going down this rabbit trail to keep me from disputing erroneous information.
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Just because they disagree with Al Gore does not mean they are not dealing with the scientific merits of the issue.
Yes it does. They are dealing with the man's character, not the issue.
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Just because they disagree with Al Gore and they may point out counterarguments to his position does not mean they are intellectually lazy.
It is if their whole purpose is to discredit him because he is Al Gore. And this is precisely what they do.
< Message edited by 1dblthnk02 -- 5/8/2008 10:23:07 PM >
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RE: Global warming- do you know the truth? - 5/8/2008 10:19:25 PM
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StephK
Posts: 1525
Joined: 4/11/2005
From: Southwest Louisiana
Status: offline
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Al Gore isn't a scientist. He has a degree in government and was a theology major and then a journalism major. Why are people buying his hot air?
_____________________________
Stephanie
"If one starts with an impersonal beginning, the answer to morals eventually turns out to be the assertion that there are no morals." ~Francis Schaeffer
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RE: Global warming- do you know the truth? - 5/8/2008 10:24:02 PM
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lightshineon
Posts: 3315
Joined: 4/11/2005
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He thinks he invented everything. He wants to be famous, because he cannot win a presidental election. OK, I will be nice, but I will not use one sheet of toliet paper.
quote:
ORIGINAL: StephK
Al Gore isn't a scientist. He has a degree in government and was a theology major and then a journalism major. Why are people buying his hot air?
_____________________________
Remember, whenever you have pearls, there are always plenty of pigs nearby who would be glad to step on them.
F.T., 2007
Be sure you vote for those, whose views you want your children to emulate.
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RE: Global warming- do you know the truth? - 5/8/2008 10:26:10 PM
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1dblthnk02
Posts: 395
Joined: 3/24/2008
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quote:
ORIGINAL: StephK
BDS = Bush Derangement Syndrome.
Ah, now I get it . . . well, not really. But at least now I know what BDS stands for.
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The US is being asked to foot the bill for the world pollution. That is why Kyoto was not signed. We would be forced to pay more than we are responsible for and we shouldn't have to do so.
Ergo global warming is not a reality?
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I just watched a program on the Science Channel on how the Rocky Mountains are being eroded by the melting glaciers and the geologists stated that this is a cycle that has been going on for eons and not from global warming.
Er, yeah-- mountains erode regardless of global warming. What's your point?
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The climate changes and has been since the dawn of time.
Sure, I'm not saying that man controls the planet. But mankind is having an indelible impact in many, many ways. To say that the ecology should not reflect the presence of 6.7 billion industrialized human beings who have unleashed everything from nonbiodegrable polymers to nuclear waste is uberdenial.
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Mankind is really just a speck of dust in comparison to the real forces of nature.
Yet, we do make a difference because we know how to harness some of those forces.
< Message edited by 1dblthnk02 -- 5/8/2008 10:33:09 PM >
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RE: Global warming- do you know the truth? - 5/8/2008 10:29:01 PM
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Bettawrekonize
Posts: 1073
Joined: 4/17/2005
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quote:
ORIGINAL: 1dblthnk02
The truth has bearing on what I choose to believe.
As those who disagree with you would argue about themselves. The question is, why should I believe you are any different? Just because you proclaim that you're better able to discern truth than others?
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Wasn't meant to be. It is evidence that one can be of a certain conviction and still look at the other side with an open mind.
As is the case of those who disagree with you.
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I am able to shoot down everyone's arguments. What does that show you?
"You're wrong because I'm right" is not shooting down their arguments.
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Can we get beyond this, please?
When you stop implying that you are somehow better at discerning truth than others.
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If I have nothing to back it up, then it is not good argumentation.
I agree. My point is that there are those who disagree with you and you should not be intolerant of them by labeling them, "intellectually lazy." Simply giving people who disagree with you derogatory labels is not backing up your arguments.
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Again, I have said a good deal more than that. You kep honing in on it hoping to redirect the thread from what else I have said.
It's obvious.
No, I just want people who agree with you to be more tolerant of those who disagree with you. I have given examples of your own intolerance (ie: giving people who disagree with you derogatory labels). You are free to express your opinions as to why you think global warming is true or not (and I am not arguing for or against global warming) but please, be more tolerant of those who oppose you. Labeling them intellectually lazy is not an argument.
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I don't care if people take me seriously.
Then why waste your time here (I suppose you could want to strengthen your own views but a, "This is true because I believe it" attitude does not seem too constructive in that respect)?
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It isn't the best I can do, and we both know it. You keep going down this rabbit trail to keep me from disputing erroneous information.
My point is that you (and others who agree with you) can be more tolerant of those who disagree with you.
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Yes it does. They are dealing with the man's character, not the issue.
Again, "Just because they disagree with Al Gore does not mean they are not dealing with the scientific merits of the issue." Just because someone disagrees with you doesn't mean they are dealing with your character and not the issues. This is rather short sighted.
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It is if their whole purpose is to discredit him because he is Al Gore. And this is precisely what they do.
Ditto.
< Message edited by Bettawrekonize -- 5/9/2008 12:10:32 AM >
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RE: Global warming- do you know the truth? - 5/8/2008 10:30:43 PM
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1dblthnk02
Posts: 395
Joined: 3/24/2008
Status: offline
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quote:
ORIGINAL: StephK
Al Gore isn't a scientist. He has a degree in government and was a theology major and then a journalism major. Why are people buying his hot air?
And here we go . . .
We can't make a reasonable argument against global warming, so we'll indulge in ad hominem and try to discredit Al Gore by pretending that he came with the whole thing after being on the pipe all night.
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RE: Global warming- do you know the truth? - 5/8/2008 10:32:12 PM
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1dblthnk02
Posts: 395
Joined: 3/24/2008
Status: offline
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quote:
ORIGINAL: lightshineon
He thinks he invented everything.
Yes, this is exactly what he has said:
"I'm AL Gore and I invented everything."
Therefore, global warming is not real.
Thank you for proving me right- again.
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RE: Global warming- do you know the truth? - 5/8/2008 10:37:06 PM
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1dblthnk02
Posts: 395
Joined: 3/24/2008
Status: offline
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quote:
ORIGINAL: Bettawrekonize
You are free to express your opinions as to why you think global warming is true or not (and I am not arguing for or against global warming) but please, be more tolerant of those who oppose you. Labeling them intellectually lazy is not an argument.
Ahem-- I direct your attention to posts # 205 & 206 . . .
'nuff said?
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Then why waste your time here (I suppose you could want to strengthen your own views)?
Yes. Is that okay with you?
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RE: Global warming- do you know the truth? - 5/8/2008 10:52:27 PM
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lightshineon
Posts: 3315
Joined: 4/11/2005
Status: offline
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Chill out, I was joking trying to break the mean, and hateful train blowing through current events. Can't you take a joke?
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ORIGINAL: 1dblthnk02
quote:
ORIGINAL: lightshineon
He thinks he invented everything.
Yes, this is exactly what he has said:
"I'm AL Gore and I invented everything."
Therefore, global warming is not real.
Thank you for proving me right- again.
_____________________________
Remember, whenever you have pearls, there are always plenty of pigs nearby who would be glad to step on them.
F.T., 2007
Be sure you vote for those, whose views you want your children to emulate.
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RE: Global warming- do you know the truth? - 5/8/2008 11:00:25 PM
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blessedinnyc
Posts: 1107
Joined: 10/12/2007
Status: online
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quote:
ORIGINAL: lightshineon
Chill out, I was joking trying to break the mean, and hateful train blowing through current events. Can't you take a joke?
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ORIGINAL: 1dblthnk02
quote:
ORIGINAL: lightshineon
He thinks he invented everything.
Yes, this is exactly what he has said:
"I'm AL Gore and I invented everything."
Therefore, global warming is not real.
Thank you for proving me right- again.
I'm extremely angry at Al Gore.
The University of Illinois invented the internet (google Mosaic). I don't care if he gave our school funding, I hope a flock of spotted owls all hoot at the harmonic frequency of his skull all at the same time... 
< Message edited by blessedinnyc -- 5/8/2008 11:08:46 PM >
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RE: Global warming- do you know the truth? - 5/8/2008 11:03:03 PM
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lightshineon
Posts: 3315
Joined: 4/11/2005
Status: offline
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Oh, not mad at ol Al, even though Tipper and He, were the insperation for " Love Story", except Tipper lived.
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ORIGINAL: blessedinnyc
quote:
ORIGINAL: lightshineon
Chill out, I was joking trying to break the mean, and hateful train blowing through current events. Can't you take a joke?
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ORIGINAL: 1dblthnk02
quote:
ORIGINAL: lightshineon
He thinks he invented everything.
Yes, this is exactly what he has said:
"I'm AL Gore and I invented everything."
Therefore, global warming is not real.
Thank you for proving me right- again.
I'm extremely angry at Al Gore.
The University of Illinois invented the internet (google Mosaic). I don't care if he gave our school funding, I hope a flock of spotted owls all hoot at the harmonic frequency of his skull all at the same time...
_____________________________
Remember, whenever you have pearls, there are always plenty of pigs nearby who would be glad to step on them.
F.T., 2007
Be sure you vote for those, whose views you want your children to emulate.
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RE: Global warming- do you know the truth? - 5/8/2008 11:37:38 PM
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StephK
Posts: 1525
Joined: 4/11/2005
From: Southwest Louisiana
Status: offline
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quote:
ORIGINAL: 1dblthnk02
quote:
ORIGINAL: StephK
Al Gore isn't a scientist. He has a degree in government and was a theology major and then a journalism major. Why are people buying his hot air?
And here we go . . .
We can't make a reasonable argument against global warming, so we'll indulge in ad hominem and try to discredit Al Gore by pretending that he came with the whole thing after being on the pipe all night.
No, I just stated why are people taking his word as gospel truth when he isn't a scientist. His name was brought up. He isn't an expert at anything.
_____________________________
Stephanie
"If one starts with an impersonal beginning, the answer to morals eventually turns out to be the assertion that there are no morals." ~Francis Schaeffer
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RE: Global warming- do you know the truth? - 5/9/2008 12:04:01 AM
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StephK
Posts: 1525
Joined: 4/11/2005
From: Southwest Louisiana
Status: offline
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quote:
ORIGINAL: 1dblthnk02
quote:
ORIGINAL: StephK
BDS = Bush Derangement Syndrome.
Ah, now I get it . . . well, not really. But at least now I know what BDS stands for.
1. My sister and BIL are uber liberals. They are so far left they go into conniption fits at the mention of Dubya. You can't discuss issues, like global warming with them at all because they get apoplectic. Other liberals I know are the same way. Bush is evil, you know the cause for all bad in the world today. 
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Ergo global warming is not a reality?
Why should the US foot the highest percentage of the treaty to take care of this issue? Each country should clean up their own pollution. Did I say there was no global warming? It's there but the exact cause is still questionable. Natural geological activity is more than likely responsible for most of the climate change like it has been for millennium.
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Er, yeah-- mountains erode regardless of global warming. What's your point?
Glaciers MELT, some of the chicken littles are blaming the shrinking glaciers on *gasp* global warming. The geologist on the program stated that The formation, melting and moving of glaciers happen in cycles.
The Rockies will be eroded eventually. Are we going to stop that natural process?
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Sure, I'm not saying that man controls the planet. But mankind is having an indelible impact in many, many ways. To say that the ecology should not reflect the presence of 6.7 billion industrialized human beings who have unleashed everything from nonbiodegrable polymers to nuclear waste is uberdenial.
Didn't I say that countries need to clean up the pollution? I've never stated that people destroy the earth. I stated that we should all be good stewards and be good conservationists.
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Yet, we do make a difference because we know how to harness some of those forces.
I've had the good fortune to live on an the Big Island and see the volcano up close and personal as well as live through a major hurricane hitting my area. Mankind can not compete with nature. We may prepare and evacuate ahead of time but we are not smart enough at this time to change the weather or geologic activity. I also have witnessed how the earth is quite capable of recovering from natural disasters.
_____________________________
Stephanie
"If one starts with an impersonal beginning, the answer to morals eventually turns out to be the assertion that there are no morals." ~Francis Schaeffer
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RE: Global warming- do you know the truth? - 5/9/2008 12:16:14 AM
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Bettawrekonize
Posts: 1073
Joined: 4/17/2005
Status: offline
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quote:
ORIGINAL: 1dblthnk02
Ahem-- I direct your attention to posts # 205 & 206 . . .
'nuff said?
If Al Gore doesn't have a science degree, there is nothing wrong with pointing this out (though it doesn't do anything to negate global warming). Aside from that, I have not claimed that everyone on the opposite side it perfect either (though there is nothing wrong with them joking around. You are free to do the same). However, this is not to say that the agenda of conservative sites is, "not to examine the evidence fairly, but to dogmatically counter global warming with, "See? There is no such thing." " and I think that you should be more careful before making such dogmatic statements.
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Then why waste your time here (I suppose you could want to strengthen your own views)?
Yes. Is that okay with you?
Sorry, I didn't finish that statement at the time. It's finished now. You may go back and read it.
< Message edited by Bettawrekonize -- 5/9/2008 12:28:13 AM >
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RE: Global warming- do you know the truth? - 5/9/2008 12:20:52 AM
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Bettawrekonize
Posts: 1073
Joined: 4/17/2005
Status: offline
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quote:
ORIGINAL: 1dblthnk02
No, my mind was made up prejudicially. I didn't accept the whole global warming theory. But, I took a fuller look at the evidence anyway just to be sure.
but you can't expect one to believe two contradicting sides at the same time.
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RE: Global warming- do you know the truth? - 5/9/2008 7:19:09 AM
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Lizahana
Posts: 530
Joined: 4/20/2005
Status: offline
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quote:
ORIGINAL: StephK
Al Gore isn't a scientist. He has a degree in government and was a theology major and then a journalism major. Why are people buying his hot air?
Because he got the information (that global warming is here and it is caused by humans in part) from scientists from: countries all over the world; the UN; our own government EPA; the IPCC; NASA; the NOAA - now, I posted direct links to these sites (in post #170 in this very thread), but people here seem to ignore them. This tells me either they are too lazy to look at them; they alread read them and are in denial; or they plainly don't want to read them. And if you say these are biased sources, please explain why. While doing that, please keep in mind that these are US government organizations and international government organizations that could care less how one votes in America, as they have more important things to think about than silly mundane things like that.
Now, even if you don't believe that humans play a part in global warming - what countries all over the world; the UN; our own government EPA; the IPCC; NASA; the NOAA are saying, again, what is the big deal about taking the steps that they are saying? I mean, wouldn't it be great if asthmatic kids could play outside during ozone action days? Wouldn't it be great to take harmful toxins out of the environment (you know, the ones that have been linked to cancer and increased incidence of asthma in the environment) - wouldn't that be great? And what about recycling - my grandparents generation did this with no questions asked during the wars - honestly, what is the big deal?
And most importantly God commands us to take care of what is His in Genesis 2:15 And the LORD God took the man, and put him into the garden of Eden to dress it and to keep it.
Peace and God bless,
< Message edited by Lizahana -- 5/9/2008 7:33:25 AM >
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RE: Global warming- do you know the truth? - 5/9/2008 8:27:46 AM
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Judah1966
Posts: 250
Joined: 8/12/2006
Status: offline
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To the orginal question Yes I believe in global warming but not the world version.The earth is and will continue to convulse until Christ comes back.The earths condition however is because of mans sins.Man can not save this planet and believers know that.God says soon the earth will be on fire and that man would completely distroy himself If God wouldnt come back again to bring true peace and straighten this mess out but our Messiah will come from the sky and every eye will see Him on that day.Yes I do things to help out like not run so much water picking up trash but I wont take it to the extreme.Because I know and believe the whole story.
_____________________________
Treat others the way you want to be treated and you will fulfill the requirements of the law and live.My pic is some of Hurricane Katrina coming on land in 05.We relocated because of it and will continue to feel its affects maybe for life.
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RE: Global warming- do you know the truth? - 5/9/2008 8:46:36 AM
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1dblthnk02
Posts: 395
Joined: 3/24/2008
Status: offline
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quote:
ORIGINAL: Bettawrekonize
As those who disagree with you would argue about themselves. The question is, why should I believe you are any different?
Actually, this is a valid question. You have no reason to take my word for it prima facie. I know that I think for myself, but you don't know that.
Also, I labor under a bit of prejudice when it comes to those from the right. I have known too many right wingers who truly do not think for themselves. In a "current events"-type discussion, all I hear from their mouths are the "sound bytes" (slogans that would fit on the average bumper sticker) spoon-fed to them by the likes of Sean Hannity and Rush Limbaugh.
It's one thing if someone reaches a conclusion that I don't agree via their own intellect; it's quite another if I perceive that they let the right wing media do their thinking for them: oft repeated slogans are a tell-tale sign.
Now, maybe I have passed undue judgement on those posting here. If so, I am truly sorry. But the fact is that I have also been unduly judged by those who disagree with me, so I am not alone in my prejudice.
And at least I admit it.
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"You're wrong because I'm right" is not shooting down their arguments.
Look back through the pages, Betta. I have countered argument after argument before I got to "I am right." Give me a little credit.
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I agree. My point is that there are those who disagree with you and you should not be intolerant of them by labeling them, "intellectually lazy." Simply giving people who disagree with you derogatory labels is not backing up your arguments.
Let's be clear here: I did not level this charge at any individual. I said that ad hominem arguments are intellectually lazy and irresponsible, and that is so.
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RE: Global warming- do you know the truth? - 5/9/2008 9:13:53 AM
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1dblthnk02
Posts: 395
Joined: 3/24/2008
Status: offline
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quote:
ORIGINAL: lightshineon
Chill out, I was joking trying to break the mean, and hateful train blowing through current events. Can't you take a joke?
No, I have no sense of humor. I am much better at "mean and hateful."
But don't let me rain on your jocularity.
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ORIGINAL: StephK
No, I just stated why are people taking his word as gospel truth when he isn't a scientist. His name was brought up. He isn't an expert at anything.
Oh, I think he is an expert that-which-is-expelled-from-the-back-end-of-a-bull artist. After all, he is a politician.
But I find it disingenuous that the same people- hopefully not you- will take Ben Stein's word for it when it comes to another scientific topic. He's no expert, either.
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Bush is evil, you know the cause for all bad in the world today.
I do not like him. But I am far madder at the system that allowed him to trash the Constitution for two full terms.
But that's another topic.
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Did I say there was no global warming? It's there but the exact cause is still questionable.
No, everyone is pretty much settled on what causes global warming. Deforestation is the biggest single contributor.
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Natural geological activity is more than likely responsible for most of the climate change like it has been for millennium.
In the past this was true. But we're not living in the past, are we.
Deforestation and industrial pollution (including all man-made emissions) are a reality now, whereas this was not the case in millenia past. Right now, we are the ones impacting the climate. Add a major natural contributor, and then we have a real problem on our hands, now don't we.
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Glaciers MELT, some of the chicken littles are blaming the shrinking glaciers on *gasp* global warming.
Yes, and this "chicken little" agrees.
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The geologist on the program stated that The formation, melting and moving of glaciers happen in cycles.
The Rockies will be eroded eventually. Are we going to stop that natural process?
I'm sorry, but I must clarify: do you understand the difference between mountains and glaciers?
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Didn't I say that countries need to clean up the pollution? I've never stated that people destroy the earth. I stated that we should all be good stewards and be good conservationists.
What for? You have already stated that global warming happens in cycles. We don't impact anything. Why bother cleaning up after ourselves if all of our climate problems are just natural cycles?
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I've had the good fortune to live on an the Big Island and see the volcano up close and personal as well as live through a major hurricane hitting my area. Mankind can not compete with nature.
Oh, how wrong you are.
Volcanoes are very destructive in the short term, but in the long run they actually benefit life. Volcano sites become near-paradises in a relatively short time.
Man, on the other hand, is unleashing all kinds of toxic wastes that may never go away. Furthermore, deforestation is a man-mand process happening at a daily rate that no volcano can compete with in the long haul. Comparing volcanoes and man is like comparing a house fire with a termite infestation.
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We may prepare and evacuate ahead of time but we are not smart enough at this time to change the weather or geologic activity.
We don't have to be smart, just greedy and rapacious.
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RE: Global warming- do you know the truth? - 5/9/2008 10:33:18 AM
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mapachito13
Posts: 1007
Joined: 10/1/2007
Status: offline
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All of these doomsday forecasters have been wrong. These so called experts have been predicting global catastrophes for decades. Remember in 1973 it was predicted we would be out of all "fossil fuels" by 1988. Here we are 20 years later with known reserves much greater than in 1973 with more oil being discovered all the time.
They have predicted more hurricanes as we warm up and last years hurricane season saw numbers of hurricanes and major hurricanes at the NOAA average of the last 50 years.
Now if all this CO2, global warming stuff is directly related and our CO2 levels are the highest they have ever been, global temperatures should be increasing consistently with this amount of CO2 and, therefore, the number of hurricanes should be increasing as well every year since they are directly related. I've increased the catalyst that retains the sun's heat, right? But, alas, we see no direct correlation between CO2 levels and temperature, otherwise we wouldn't have a drop in last winter's temperature but we would see another increase.
The experts predicted 2-3 degrees C increase and we see less than 1 degree. Looks like their science is flawed. The meteorologist in the morning predicts a high temperature for our area and the actual temperature varies by sometimes 3-5 degrees F either way. If they can't predict temperatures with precision one day in advance, why should I trust these same experts to predict it years and decades in advance! There are more variables that account for weather than their supercomputers can account for.
BTW, I run an internationally accredited test lab so I know how to interpret data too! I am still awaiting publishing of uncertainty values in their CO2 and temperature predictions. I bet they are higher than they would like to admit. Anyone have a link to the test methodology of those ice core samples? It would make for an interesting read!
_____________________________
Three Nails to protect us!
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RE: Global warming- do you know the truth? - 5/9/2008 10:48:29 AM
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1dblthnk02
Posts: 395
Joined: 3/24/2008
Status: offline
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quote:
ORIGINAL: mapachito13
All of these doomsday forecasters have been wrong.
Let's use another example: many religious leaders throughout the last 2000 years have incorrectly predicted Christ's return. Does it follow that, therefore, it ain't gonna happen?
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They have predicted more hurricanes as we warm up and last years hurri | | |
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