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RE: :: Lakeland Revival - Todd Bentley - 7/9/2008 7:00:14 AM
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earthless
Posts: 5603
Joined: 4/11/2005
From: where pigeons are getting their sweaters ready....
Status: online
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quote:
ORIGINAL: Corne
quote:
ORIGINAL: wintery
Out of curiosity, you excused Todd Bentley's baptism by saying that he had not really intended baptize in the name of "Bam", and yet a representative of this ministry declares that is exactly what he did. Once you verify this statement in the video, will you acknowledge that Bentley is a false teacher?
I made no endorsement. Reread post 2633.
But after viewing the evidence you can indeed make a proper judgment in light of Scripture.
_____________________________
Probing Today's Religious Movements | Promoting Doctrinal Discernment & Critical Thinking | Providing Reasons for Christian Faith & Ethics
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RE: :: Lakeland Revival - Todd Bentley - 7/9/2008 10:01:48 AM
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benelchi
Posts: 2357
Joined: 9/14/2007
From: California
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quote:
ORIGINAL: peacebringer
It wasn't Garvin, it was the MC Guy.
I assumed it was Garvin because he looked just like this guy ; however, if it wasn't him, it was a guy who look like him i.e. the one who gave the message about two hours into the video after the worship time ended.
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RE: :: Lakeland Revival - Todd Bentley - 7/9/2008 10:06:02 AM
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wintery
Posts: 1707
Joined: 2/1/2007
From: nw alabama
Status: offline
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quote:
ORIGINAL: csl7037
quote:
ORIGINAL: benelchi
BTW - isn't that song leader the most tone deaf, off key singer you have ever heard lead worship? I wanted to turn him off so bad, but without being able to rewind, I knew I had to listen. At least the pause button still worked, so I could get a break in once in a while.
Aren't they in a huge open-air arena? I'm as nauseated by the next at what's going on in Lakeland but I think this is what some here have referred to as unneccesary and unhelpful jabs. Whatever Todd Bentley's faults, I'm quite certain he doesn't hire tone deaf worship leaders. It may have something to do with the haphazard set up they have out there, the acoustics of the situation and quality of the sound - ya think?
Poor Roy...it reminds me that 90% of life is just showing up. Maybe his monitors are bad (set up wrong, not close enough to him, bad mix from the sound guy)--I haven't noticed if he has any. I think he can sing but for some reason he sounds off-key often.
I think it is a relevant comment because Lakeland's defenders have pointed to the "worship" quite often as being so great. I remember he tried out a Lenny LeBlanc song the other night and knowing Lenny and having heard him in person I can't help but compare. I've also run a few sound boards and you learn to listen for these things.
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RE: :: Lakeland Revival - Todd Bentley - 7/9/2008 10:11:06 AM
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wintery
Posts: 1707
Joined: 2/1/2007
From: nw alabama
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quote:
ORIGINAL: csl7037
Now that Pastor says he's going (I don't know when but I assume he meant some time this week), could you guys - earthless, wintery, etc. just agree with me that he would go with a supernatural discernment and his eyes wide open. It makes me nauseous to think of my Pastor putting himself in the path of this "ministry".
yes, and I hope everyone on here will pray for your pastor.
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RE: :: Lakeland Revival - Todd Bentley - 7/9/2008 10:17:19 AM
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benelchi
Posts: 2357
Joined: 9/14/2007
From: California
Status: offline
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quote:
ORIGINAL: csl7037
quote:
ORIGINAL: benelchi
BTW - isn't that song leader the most tone deaf, off key singer you have ever heard lead worship? I wanted to turn him off so bad, but without being able to rewind, I knew I had to listen. At least the pause button still worked, so I could get a break in once in a while.
Aren't they in a huge open-air arena? I'm as nauseated by the next at what's going on in Lakeland but I think this is what some here have referred to as unneccesary and unhelpful jabs. Whatever Todd Bentley's faults, I'm quite certain he doesn't hire tone deaf worship leaders. It may have something to do with the haphazard set up they have out there, the acoustics of the situation and quality of the sound - ya think?
Listen to the guy sing for a while, and see if you still believe that!!!
I do understand the difficulty of running a sound system in those conditions, as I used to be a sound technician for several different bands for many years. This singer is off key more than even bad monitors could possibly account for. I listened to him sing for two hours, so I could get to the part to verify the statement that wintery and made.
For the record, it is the doctrine at Lakeland that really bothers me. If everyone really came just to hear the bad singing I really wouldn't care (unless I had to sit through it); the singing would probably make me cringe a bit, but it is the doctrine that really makes me feel sick.
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RE: :: Lakeland Revival - Todd Bentley - 7/9/2008 11:19:16 AM
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peacebringer
Posts: 225
Joined: 5/20/2006
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quote:
ORIGINAL: wintery
quote:
ORIGINAL: csl7037
Now that Pastor says he's going (I don't know when but I assume he meant some time this week), could you guys - earthless, wintery, etc. just agree with me that he would go with a supernatural discernment and his eyes wide open. It makes me nauseous to think of my Pastor putting himself in the path of this "ministry".
yes, and I hope everyone on here will pray for your pastor.
Done. May God open is eyes, ears and heart. May he be filled with awareness of the presence of evil, may he be sensitive to the HOly Spirit, May he be AWAKE and ALERT. Amen.
_____________________________
http://peacebringer7.wordpress.com/
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RE: :: Lakeland Revival - Todd Bentley - 7/9/2008 11:22:11 AM
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peacebringer
Posts: 225
Joined: 5/20/2006
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quote:
ORIGINAL: benelchi
quote:
ORIGINAL: peacebringer
It wasn't Garvin, it was the MC Guy.
I assumed it was Garvin because he looked just like this guy ; however, if it wasn't him, it was a guy who look like him i.e. the one who gave the message about two hours into the video after the worship time ended.
Garvin was the thick set dude with the Tatoos and preaching and screaming about "kingdom now" theology. The MC was the scrawnier, geeky looking dude. Oh and the comments certainly didn't come off as a "joke." But I guess that comment and Bentley's T-Shirts just shouldn't be taken seriously.
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http://peacebringer7.wordpress.com/
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RE: :: Lakeland Revival - Todd Bentley - 7/9/2008 12:44:07 PM
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wintery
Posts: 1707
Joined: 2/1/2007
From: nw alabama
Status: offline
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quote:
ORIGINAL: peacebringer
quote:
ORIGINAL: benelchi
quote:
ORIGINAL: peacebringer
It wasn't Garvin, it was the MC Guy.
I assumed it was Garvin because he looked just like this guy ; however, if it wasn't him, it was a guy who look like him i.e. the one who gave the message about two hours into the video after the worship time ended.
Garvin was the thick set dude with the Tatoos and preaching and screaming about "kingdom now" theology. The MC was the scrawnier, geeky looking dude. Oh and the comments certainly didn't come off as a "joke." But I guess that comment and Bentley's T-Shirts just shouldn't be taken seriously.
Yeah I didn't remember correctly which one said it but how is it that they would even say that? I didn't see the baptisms until Monday so when I heard that Saturday night I certainly believed the guy was telling what happened--what else would I think?
It lends to the idea that controversy is intentional at Lakeland. There is an idea some entertainment promoters buy into--"there is no such thing as bad publicity".
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RE: :: Lakeland Revival - Todd Bentley - 7/9/2008 12:50:50 PM
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peacebringer
Posts: 225
Joined: 5/20/2006
Status: offline
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quote:
ORIGINAL: wintery
quote:
ORIGINAL: peacebringer
quote:
ORIGINAL: benelchi
quote:
ORIGINAL: peacebringer
It wasn't Garvin, it was the MC Guy.
I assumed it was Garvin because he looked just like this guy ; however, if it wasn't him, it was a guy who look like him i.e. the one who gave the message about two hours into the video after the worship time ended.
Garvin was the thick set dude with the Tatoos and preaching and screaming about "kingdom now" theology. The MC was the scrawnier, geeky looking dude. Oh and the comments certainly didn't come off as a "joke." But I guess that comment and Bentley's T-Shirts just shouldn't be taken seriously.
Yeah I didn't remember correctly which one said it but how is it that they would even say that? I didn't see the baptisms until Monday so when I heard that Saturday night I certainly believed the guy was telling what happened--what else would I think?
It lends to the idea that controversy is intentional at Lakeland. There is an idea some entertainment promoters buy into--"there is no such thing as bad publicity".
From what I observed of the guy, he struck me as someone who may speak what he thinks before filtering. I don't think it was a "humor" moment and not connecting to Flinstones in anyway. He simply spoke what he thought. Now I could be wrong, but usually God gives me good insight and perception.
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http://peacebringer7.wordpress.com/
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RE: :: Lakeland Revival - Todd Bentley - 7/9/2008 1:27:58 PM
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Corne
Posts: 1215
Status: offline
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quote:
ORIGINAL: earthless
quote:
ORIGINAL: Corne
quote:
ORIGINAL: wintery
Out of curiosity, you excused Todd Bentley's baptism by saying that he had not really intended baptize in the name of "Bam", and yet a representative of this ministry declares that is exactly what he did. Once you verify this statement in the video, will you acknowledge that Bentley is a false teacher?
I made no endorsement. Reread post 2633.
But after viewing the evidence you can indeed make a proper judgment in light of Scripture.
Of course proper judgements can be made on these things. Some in this thread try to insist all participants make an official position statement on TB. Sorry it's not my style or intention. I do like the devil's advocate role, not for irritation but for refining a discussion. A discussion like this settles into a mode. Things are assumed. Things are said a certain way, And that's it. If you truly want an audience for your alarms, you better be credible. It's not enough to have settled the major doctrinal issues for yourselves in this thread and then get on with the emotional experience of watching the "freakshow" and pointing fingers. Throw in false or questionable claims about what was said and now you have lost a GREAT deal of credibility.
A lot of finger pointing about the baptism videos yesterday. No one calmly said, this is what would be biblical and this is what was wrong. It was offered as "see, what a freakshow, I told you this was bad." (except for the in the name thing which really didn't....hold water...if you looked closely and honestly. What the ten minute baptism video was supposed to affirm in error, I can't figure out.
Criticising the quality of worship leader's voice etc, hurts your cause also. Lakeland attendees are going to think your motives are pure and holy if you're taking shots at the voice of the worship leader? What is worship all about anyway? Would it be proper to do that if the worship leader was in a meeting full of doctrine that you approved of?
About the comment the MC made about the baptism: it was clear throughout the entire sermon, beginning with the MC that Lakeland is receiving a great deal of criticism and are reacting to it. Gavin mentions this kind of thing for two hours sprinkled into his sermon. He has strong words for those not wanting a dynamic (from his POV) Christianity and makes his share of looking down, sarcastic remarks. The classic, "charismatic TYPE vs. others" perspective. The MC was being very casual and I believe sarcastic when he mentioned in the name of bam-bam. He didn't say bam! bam! He said it just like a reference to the cartoon character. It's not about excusing anything, it's about accuracy in reporting. Think about it, did I suggest that baptism need not be done properly or in the name of... biblically? Remember, humans hear what they expect. It's true for those with good doctrine too. It's the human mind. It's hard to sort out what we've heard sometimes.
Sorting it out often fascinates me but I don't know where you all get your free time for this, I'm about out of it.
< Message edited by Corne -- 7/9/2008 1:41:51 PM >
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RE: :: Lakeland Revival - Todd Bentley - 7/9/2008 1:35:21 PM
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Lapidoth
Posts: 3319
Joined: 4/13/2005
From: OKLAHOMA
Status: offline
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A minister's reply after brownsville and toronto.
Before Lakeland, but still applies.
revival
_____________________________
Why does He keep quoting Torah? Doesn't He know He's about to abolish it?
http://www.tedpearce.com/Videos/TheForgottenpeople.html
BARUCH HABA BASHEM YAHUAH
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RE: :: Lakeland Revival - Todd Bentley - 7/9/2008 1:41:13 PM
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wintery
Posts: 1707
Joined: 2/1/2007
From: nw alabama
Status: offline
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quote:
ORIGINAL: Corne
Sorting it out often fascinates me but I don't know where you all get your free time for this, I'm about out of it.
Speaking of sorting it out, there's a quote from earthless that keeps getting attributed to me. No biggie here, just mentioning in case anyone gets confused.
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RE: :: Lakeland Revival - Todd Bentley - 7/9/2008 1:43:07 PM
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Lapidoth
Posts: 3319
Joined: 4/13/2005
From: OKLAHOMA
Status: offline
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quote:
"You would think you walked into a mad house"
So said John Arnott of the Toronto Airport Christian Fellowship
video collection
_____________________________
Why does He keep quoting Torah? Doesn't He know He's about to abolish it?
http://www.tedpearce.com/Videos/TheForgottenpeople.html
BARUCH HABA BASHEM YAHUAH
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RE: :: Lakeland Revival - Todd Bentley - 7/9/2008 2:00:14 PM
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Lapidoth
Posts: 3319
Joined: 4/13/2005
From: OKLAHOMA
Status: offline
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quote:
Today, we hear about power, 'Holy Ghost' power. We don't hear about holiness. Revival comes when sorrow for sins strikes and we see ourselves as we truly are, sinful and needy, lacking holiness. Revivals in the past have had this as their beginning point. Finney tells of one great revival that began when a blacksmith was broken-hearted over the sin and carelessness of the young people in his town, and one work-day, became so burdened that he closed his smithy for the day and just wept and prayed before God. Late in the day, he went to the minister and asked if a meeting could be held. The minister didn't think anything would come of it, but agreed and called a church meeting that evening. People came, and the minister not knowing what to do, the congregation sat quietly for a few minutes. Finney tells us that soon, one of the young women of the town that the blacksmith was burdened for started weeping, and confessing her sin and guilt. Soon many more felt that same burden of sin and sought God. Revival came to that town.
That same thing happened at Asbury College in 1975. At a chapel meeting at that Christian school, a young girl became overwhelmed with her sinfulness before God and started weeping in sorrow and repentance. The Spirit of God came down so unexpectedly that the chapel became overwhelmed with sorrow for sins. The meeting went on for days. Students and professors alike confessed sins and sought God's forgiveness for their careless walk with Him. 25 years later, the Asbury Revival is considered a "classic" example of a move of God.
Another great revival that we Pentecostals don't hear much about, because it doesn't have colorful character and spectacular manifestations, was the Prayer Revival of 1858. A man went to a church in New York City and asked if he could start a prayer meeting during the noon-hour, during the workweek. He was given permission to do so, and an announcement appeared in the newspaper announcing it. The first meeting had about 6 people come in. Within weeks, the meeting had to be moved to a meeting hall. Within months, there were daily prayer meetings around the city. So many businessmen took part in the meetings that business halted in NYC during prayer meeting time. By the end of the year, prayer meetings sprang up in every major city in the nation, and business came to a halt. I believe that one figure I read was that 100,000 people were saved in the two years of that revival. One has said that the only thing that stopped that revival was the Civil War.
"Holy Ghost Power!"
_____________________________
Why does He keep quoting Torah? Doesn't He know He's about to abolish it?
http://www.tedpearce.com/Videos/TheForgottenpeople.html
BARUCH HABA BASHEM YAHUAH
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RE: :: Lakeland Revival - Todd Bentley - 7/9/2008 2:30:12 PM
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benelchi
Posts: 2357
Joined: 9/14/2007
From: California
Status: offline
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quote:
ORIGINAL: Corne
Of course proper judgements can be made on these things. Some in this thread try to insist all participants make an official position statement on TB. Sorry it's not my style or intention. I do like the devil's advocate role, not for irritation but for refining a discussion. A discussion like this settles into a mode. Things are assumed. Things are said a certain way, And that's it. If you truly want an audience for your alarms, you better be credible. It's not enough to have settled the major doctrinal issues for yourselves in this thread and then get on with the emotional experience of watching the "freakshow" and pointing fingers. Throw in false or questionable claims about what was said and now you have lost a GREAT deal of credibility.
A lot of finger pointing about the baptism videos yesterday. No one calmly said, this is what would be biblical and this is what was wrong. It was offered as "see, what a freakshow, I told you this was bad." (except for the in the name thing which really didn't....hold water...if you looked closely and honestly. What the ten minute baptism video was supposed to affirm in error, I can't figure out.
In order to come to this conclusion you have to assume that the videos didn't give an accurate representation of what was going on in Lakeland, that the MC's comments were just in jest, etc... I am sorry, but these videos seem to be very accurate depiction of what happened that night in Lakeland, and I see absolutely no reason to assume that the MC's comments were not a serious acknowledgment of what happened the evening before in Lakeland.
Your bias in this issue comes across loud and clear when you continually accuse people on this board if being inaccurate, emotional, etc... because they simply accepted at face value what those in Lakeland said rather than coming up with some way to excuse what was said by these men. Why is it that you can find some way to dismiss every criticism raised against what is happening in Lakeland, and yet seek out every possible way to raise criticism against those who reject the idea that what is happening at Lakeland is a valid work of God. It seems like an awfully big double standard to me!
quote:
Criticising the quality of worship leader's voice etc, hurts your cause also. Lakeland attendees are going to think your motives are pure and holy if you're taking shots at the voice of the worship leader? What is worship all about anyway? Would it be proper to do that if the worship leader was in a meeting full of doctrine that you approved of?
If the worship leader at my own church was this bad, YES I would raise the issue with the leadership of my church. I would raise this issue, not because of a doctrinal problem, but because this man would not be the most qualified worship leader. As a music minor in college, I may be a little bit more sensitive to this than most, but it really did hurt to listen to this man sing. I wouldn't leave or encourage anyone to leave a church because of bad singing, but I might come late and skip the worship time at my church if this were the weekly practice. Good or Bad theology aside, it would hurt to much to just sit a listen to it. And I can assure you, I am far from the only one who cringes when the music is really, really bad; I know many who really would leave a church over this issue.
On a different note: If I approached my leadership about the bad singing of the worship leader, and was met with the kind response you presented i.e. "criticizing the quality of the worship leader's voice hurts your case, etc..." I would have a much bigger problem with the leadership, as that kind of attitude truly isn't Godly. Sometimes the leadership of any church is going to make decisions that the membership does not agree with, and that might include leaving a unqualified song leader in that role. When these kinds of issue arise, I can accept a decision from my leadership that I might not agree with, but if their response is to attack anyone raising the issue simply because they raised the issue then something far bigger is really wrong, and that is reason to consider leaving a church. The idea that a leader should never be questioned or held accountable, etc.. is very far from biblical. Given an issue like the style or quality of the music, submitting to the leadership is always the right choice because there is no issue of sin involved, but raising the issue should never be something we should be reluctant to do, nor is it something we should criticized for doing. In congregation that is functioning as God intended, it is one way that the gifts of different members can be used to build one another up.
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RE: :: Lakeland Revival - Todd Bentley - 7/9/2008 2:38:41 PM
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Lapidoth
Posts: 3319
Joined: 4/13/2005
From: OKLAHOMA
Status: offline
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quote:
Hi,
I live in Lakeland and I have a few observations.
First, I work and live in this "revival" town and have yet to have anyone of the tens of thousands who have been "revived" contact any of my non-Christian friends. In fact they're oblivious to the goings on as are most of the area, besides maybe seeing/hearing/reading some of the local media giving a token reporting of what is going on.
It seems to be a "groupie" revival, just for the "hungry" Christians, I guess. Thousands are spending their hard earned, or church's, money to make the pilgrimage to the latest "outpouring."
I understand people being hungry for God.
email from Lakeland
quote:
Now it's approaching 8000 at the meetings, and they have to spend tens of thousands a night to host the event.
And an event it is, as people are coming to be touched, yet Lakeland is untouched.
Still my friends who are unsaved say they haven't heard about the meetings, except that I've asked.
So much for shaking this city, or anything for that matter, except for those affected by Todd's "ministry."
This "spirit" that has descended upon Lakeland, has attracted thousands, and will continue, if what I read in the chatroom is correct, for no other reason than that thousands are planning to come.
Too bad the sheep have to be proven stupid again.
< Message edited by Lapidoth -- 7/9/2008 2:49:23 PM >
_____________________________
Why does He keep quoting Torah? Doesn't He know He's about to abolish it?
http://www.tedpearce.com/Videos/TheForgottenpeople.html
BARUCH HABA BASHEM YAHUAH
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RE: :: Lakeland Revival - Todd Bentley - 7/9/2008 2:43:50 PM
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Corne
Posts: 1215
Status: offline
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quote:
ORIGINAL: benelchi
quote:
ORIGINAL: Corne
Of course proper judgements can be made on these things. Some in this thread try to insist all participants make an official position statement on TB. Sorry it's not my style or intention. I do like the devil's advocate role, not for irritation but for refining a discussion. A discussion like this settles into a mode. Things are assumed. Things are said a certain way, And that's it. If you truly want an audience for your alarms, you better be credible. It's not enough to have settled the major doctrinal issues for yourselves in this thread and then get on with the emotional experience of watching the "freakshow" and pointing fingers. Throw in false or questionable claims about what was said and now you have lost a GREAT deal of credibility.
A lot of finger pointing about the baptism videos yesterday. No one calmly said, this is what would be biblical and this is what was wrong. It was offered as "see, what a freakshow, I told you this was bad." (except for the in the name thing which really didn't....hold water...if you looked closely and honestly. What the ten minute baptism video was supposed to affirm in error, I can't figure out.
In order to come to this conclusion you have to assume that the videos didn't give an accurate representation of what was going on in Lakeland, that the MC's comments were just in jest, etc... I am sorry, but these videos seem to be very accurate depiction of what happened that night in Lakeland, and I see absolutely no reason to assume that the MC's comments were not a serious acknowledgment of what happened the evening before in Lakeland.
Your bias in this issue comes across loud and clear when you continually accuse people on this board if being inaccurate, emotional, etc... because they simply accepted at face value what those in Lakeland said rather than coming up with some way to excuse what was said by these men. Why is it that you can find some way to dismiss every criticism raised against what is happening in Lakeland, and yet seek out every possible way to raise criticism against those who reject the idea that what is happening at Lakeland is a valid work of God. It seems like an awfully big double standard to me!
-A few posters have combined disapproval of Lakeland AND stated that they have problems with some of the methods of criticism here.
-I have not dismissed every criticism of TB.
-"Face value" can be subjective.
-My bias is presumed on your part.
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RE: :: Lakeland Revival - Todd Bentley - 7/9/2008 3:06:38 PM
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Lapidoth
Posts: 3319
Joined: 4/13/2005
From: OKLAHOMA
Status: offline
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quote:
I'M VERY CONCERNED ABOUT THIS TODD BENTLEY & SO CALLED FLORIDA REVIVAL , EVEN MORE THAN THE TORONTO BLESSING.......We are seeing the bad fruit of the "Toronto Blessing" in New Zealand at present. My brother in law's marriage broke up just after his heavy involvement in that thing. He went loopy and lost all reason. The devastation in his life and children and ex wife has been very, very painful for our family.... I really can't begin to tell you how much.... my poor nephews and niece. It has broken our hearts. I've seen other casualties and it has grieved me so much.
We can hardly go to a church in our little town anymore where we are aren't seeing these bizarre manifestations. And if you question the leadership or church members about it(in love, I will add)you are labelled as "devisive", "rebellious", "religious" etc. All sorts of "whip words" to bring you into conformity. It really is cult like you know and a form of "spiritual abuse". Their behaviour is far from Christian.
from New Zealand
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I've seen some of my Christian friends become people I hardly know anymore..... they have left sound doctrine and there is now such alot of confusuion and strife in their lives that just wasn't there before.... very bad fruit. They have also become unteachable...
quote:
We are now seeing signs of this Todd Bentley angel move in our town and church... we don't want this demonic move in New Zealand....please don't bring anymore of it here.....WE NEED A TRUE REVIVAL, ONE OF REPENTANCE AND HUMILITY....WHERE THE FRUIT IS TRUE REVERENCE AND HOLINESS...WHERE THE WIDOWS AND ORPHANS AND THE POOR ARE TAKEN CARE OF. WE HAVE MUCH TO REPENT OF IN THIS COUNTRY AS YOU WELL KNOW.
quote:
One member in our church prayed for my son in a most bizarre way and my son became very afraid, and strange things happened to him, then he became so rebellious. We have never seen this behaviour before in him....He is fine now. We have repented of letting this man pray for him and have bound the demons at work. Praise God, we have our son back.... Dear God.....this thing is so evil.
< Message edited by Lapidoth -- 7/9/2008 3:13:13 PM >
_____________________________
Why does He keep quoting Torah? Doesn't He know He's about to abolish it?
http://www.tedpearce.com/Videos/TheForgottenpeople.html
BARUCH HABA BASHEM YAHUAH
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RE: :: Lakeland Revival - Todd Bentley - 7/9/2008 3:06:58 PM
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earthless
Posts: 5603
Joined: 4/11/2005
From: where pigeons are getting their sweaters ready....
Status: online
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Why are some treating this as if it were all one big bowl of subjective goo?
We have the concrete and absolute Word of God - the Bible.
We have the public and readily available teachings, claims, and antics of Todd Bentley and the Fresh Fire ministries easily available to everyone and anyone.
We are believers equipped to then discern and judge (test) their teachings, their prophecies, their claims, their practices in light of God's Word, the Bible.
Yet we are given all of these precipitations about what should be done and or what should not be done, etc..
In our day these false teachers have come into the churches with their books, literature, movies, psychology, and seminars, and have turned the Father's house into a den of thieves. It is time that men of God stand up and expose their errors for all to see. There is a price to pay - lost friendships, being called "heresy hunters", literally being told we are agents of Satan, unsaved, dead in sin, etc.. but it is better to be divided by truth than united in error.
_____________________________
Probing Today's Religious Movements | Promoting Doctrinal Discernment & Critical Thinking | Providing Reasons for Christian Faith & Ethics
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RE: :: Lakeland Revival - Todd Bentley - 7/9/2008 3:09:27 PM
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Lapidoth
Posts: 3319
Joined: 4/13/2005
From: OKLAHOMA
Status: offline
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quote:
It is time that men of God stand up and expose their errors for all to see. There is a price to pay - lost friendships, being called "heresy hunters", literally being told we are agents of Satan, unsaved, dead in sin, etc.. but it is better to be divided by truth than united in error.
AMEN!!!!
_____________________________
Why does He keep quoting Torah? Doesn't He know He's about to abolish it?
http://www.tedpearce.com/Videos/TheForgottenpeople.html
BARUCH HABA BASHEM YAHUAH
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RE: :: Lakeland Revival - Todd Bentley - 7/9/2008 3:14:16 PM
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Corne
Posts: 1215
Status: offline
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quote:
ORIGINAL: earthless
Why are some treating this as if it were all one big bowl of subjective goo?
We have the concrete and absolute Word of God - the Bible.
I for one don't. (who is exactly?) I have made it clear that proper judgments can and should be made.
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RE: :: Lakeland Revival - Todd Bentley - 7/9/2008 3:22:05 PM
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csl7037
Posts: 1315
Joined: 3/24/2008
Status: online
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ORIGINAL: Corne
A lot of finger pointing about the baptism videos yesterday. No one calmly said, this is what would be biblical and this is what was wrong. It was offered as "see, what a freakshow, I told you this was bad." (except for the in the name thing which really didn't....hold water...if you looked closely and honestly. What the ten minute baptism video was supposed to affirm in error, I can't figure out.
Why were all those people getting baptized? They made no confession or proclamation of salvation. The ones he asked would say something non-sensical like "I wan-it, I wan-it!" already shaking like something out of a Poltergeist movie. Of course there was the youg guy from Bentley's church in Canada who seemed to be up there auditioning for a part in the stage show. The last straw for me was when the poor little 9 year old girl came up to be baptized because she wants to be healed of a lazy eye. What??!?!?! Can anyone find me a Biblical basis for baptism for healing? The hysteria and delusion in that room was heartbreaking.
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RE: :: Lakeland Revival - Todd Bentley - 7/9/2008 3:26:24 PM
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Corne
Posts: 1215
Status: offline
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quote:
ORIGINAL: csl7037
quote:
ORIGINAL: Corne
A lot of finger pointing about the baptism videos yesterday. No one calmly said, this is what would be biblical and this is what was wrong. It was offered as "see, what a freakshow, I told you this was bad." (except for the in the name thing which really didn't....hold water...if you looked closely and honestly. What the ten minute baptism video was supposed to affirm in error, I can't figure out.
Why were all those people getting baptized? They made no confession or proclamation of salvation. The ones he asked would say something non-sensical like "I wan-it, I wan-it!" already shaking like something out of a Poltergeist movie. Of course there was the youg guy from Bentley's church in Canada who seemed to be up there auditioning for a part in the stage show. The last straw for me was when the poor little 9 year old girl came up to be baptized because she wants to be healed of a lazy eye. What??!?!?! Can anyone find me a Biblical basis for baptism for healing? The hysteria and delusion in that room was heartbreaking.
Craziness (criticise away) aside...a couple of exceptions aside, salvation WAS an issue. The ten minute video shows that.
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That sounded like casual MC humor to me. Possibly a silly reference to the Flintstones. 
I could have this wrong, but I think Corne is saying we can give people a martyr complex if we don't stick to the facts and correct any statements of the topic we find we are in error on. I think the interpretation of Bentley's tattoos was one of those issues.