|
Users viewing this topic:
none
|
|
Login  | |
|
RE: China drills for oil off shore of Cuba - 6/10/2008 10:24:50 AM
|
|
|
blessedinnyc
Posts: 1672
Joined: 10/12/2007
Status: offline
|
quote:
ORIGINAL: colliefan
quote:
According to the EIA, the US has enough reserves in the ground to meet roughly 1000 days of our oil needs:
A major reserve was just found in North Dakota, The size of the propsed drill site in ANWAR is the size of Reagan National Airport!.
We have the techology to drill for shale oil in a reasonably safe way. NONE of the oil rigs affected by Katrine spilleda drop od oil yet wackos refuse to let us drill for our own oil.
The answer is obvious. Socialists such as yourself are out to destroy the middle class in America. They so not want America to be a "City Set on a Hill." They want America to be subserviant to the UN.
IIRC, ANWR and perhaps North Dakota are included in the EIA reserve estimates.
quote:
The answer is obvious. Socialists such as yourself are out to destroy the middle class in America. They so not want America to be a "City Set on a Hill." They want America to be subserviant to the UN.
Actually, I'm a Chicago-school libertarian, and most Chicago economists would see your desire to have the government go out of its way to help Big Oil as socialist in and of itself. If I were a socialist, I wouldn't be qualified for a job at a financial institution.
quote:
The are against big oil, big retail, big drugs, and big automotives. But they are for Big Goverment. They care not one whit for the poor. Their energy policy of refusing to drill has caused prices everywhere to jump.
It isn't an accident that Earth Day is also Stalin's brithday.
The fact is that pollution does cause negative externalities, and in any free market, negative externalities need to be addressed somehow. One easy solution is to have the government address them just barely enough to let the free market handle the rest. An example of this might be the SO2 cap-and-trade system.
Even if you don't factor in the cost of negative externalities, it is apparent that wind as a source of energy is beating the pants off of oil. It's cheaper to generate and you don't have to go discover new wind patches and build new wind turbines every decade.
< Message edited by blessedinnyc -- 6/10/2008 11:41:10 AM >
|
|
|
|
|
RE: China drills for oil off shore of Cuba - 6/10/2008 11:06:51 AM
|
|
|
HighPlainsDrifter
Posts: 1074
Joined: 9/22/2005
From: Buffalo Trading Post
Status: offline
|
quote:
The answer is obvious. Socialists such as yourself are out to destroy the middle class in America. They so not want America to be a "City Set on a Hill." They want America to be subserviant to the UN.
The are against big oil, big retail, big drugs, and big automotives. But they are for Big Goverment. They care not one whit for the poor. Their energy policy of refusing to drill has caused prices everywhere to jump.
It isn't an accident that Earth Day is also Stalin's brithday.
Well said
_____________________________
Lutefisk--The Piece Of Cod That Passeth All Understanding
|
|
|
|
|
RE: China drills for oil off shore of Cuba - 6/10/2008 12:20:22 PM
|
|
|
blessedinnyc
Posts: 1672
Joined: 10/12/2007
Status: offline
|
quote:
ORIGINAL: rlj
Allowing us in Ohio to mine that high sulfur coal would drop energy prices to but everyone in the NE of the country kept whining about the acid rain. 
Regardless of acid rain, coal is getting just too expensive these days. Most utilities are switching to nuclear and wind for generation.
In any case, many of the so-called anti-socialists who want to subsidize oil drilling would likely still want us building new coal plants anyways, despite the skyrocketing cost of fuel. For those who watch the markets, however, recent developments in alternative energy represent vindications of both environmentalism and laissez-faire capitalism.
|
|
|
|
|
RE: China drills for oil off shore of Cuba - 6/10/2008 12:31:18 PM
|
|
|
colliefan
Posts: 2531
Joined: 4/12/2005
From: Raleigh, NC
Status: offline
|
quote:
Even if you don't factor in the cost of negative externalities, it is apparent that wind as a source of energy is beating the pants off of oil.
So tell me hoe wind is going to
plow the fields
sow the fields
reap the fields
get the produce to the various production fields
get what it produced to the markets
get the customers to the market
drive the police cars, ambulences, fire engines, school bus, mail truck, etc
how is wind to be used as pavement
how is wind to be used in making cell phones, IPODs, carpets, CDs, etc.
The argument is that of all liberals, full of hot air!
|
|
|
|
|
RE: China drills for oil off shore of Cuba - 6/10/2008 12:39:59 PM
|
|
|
colliefan
Posts: 2531
Joined: 4/12/2005
From: Raleigh, NC
Status: offline
|
quote:
But in reality, we are beginning to hit something called peak oil production
And people were spinning that lie thirty years ago along with the lie we were heading into a new ice age! It is precisly to the refusal to drill for ANY new oil that we are in the crisis we find today. Andour educational system has produced enough mind-numbed morons who believe it is all the fault of those evil oil companies! Yes, we need to explore for new alternatives, but not at the cost of crashing the economy!
|
|
|
|
|
RE: China drills for oil off shore of Cuba - 6/10/2008 12:41:32 PM
|
|
|
rlj
Posts: 1846
Joined: 4/14/2005
Status: offline
|
quote:
Regardless of acid rain, coal is getting just too expensive these days. Most utilities are switching to nuclear and wind for generation.
The problem with coal is the pollution and the destruction that mining can leave behind. Strip mining coal isn't overly expensive though it does leave it's marks on the land.
Does everyone realize that the last new nuclear power plant built in the US was built over 30 years ago?
_____________________________
-Roger
1 Thess 5:20 do not treat prophecies with contempt. 21 Test everything. Hold on to the good. (NIV)
|
|
|
|
|
RE: China drills for oil off shore of Cuba - 6/10/2008 12:45:53 PM
|
|
|
HighPlainsDrifter
Posts: 1074
Joined: 9/22/2005
From: Buffalo Trading Post
Status: offline
|
quote:
And people were spinning that lie thirty years ago along with the lie we were heading into a new ice age! It is precisly to the refusal to drill for ANY new oil that we are in the crisis we find today. Andour educational system has produced enough mind-numbed morons who believe it is all the fault of those evil oil companies! Yes, we need to explore for new alternatives, but not at the cost of crashing the economy!
The left is gathering it's forces for a windfall profits tax on the oil companies. I'm sure that will solve something, somehow, in some way. If that fails, the left can fall back on the Maxine Waters suggestion to nationalize oil. That'll do it.
When the question of drilling ANWR came up, slick said it'll be a good 10 years before oil can come out of it, therefore it's no solution. Well, that was 10 years ago. Thanks a lot, slick.
_____________________________
Lutefisk--The Piece Of Cod That Passeth All Understanding
|
|
|
|
|
RE: China drills for oil off shore of Cuba - 6/10/2008 12:46:38 PM
|
|
|
colliefan
Posts: 2531
Joined: 4/12/2005
From: Raleigh, NC
Status: offline
|
quote:
Does everyone realize that the last new nuclear power plant built in the US was built over 30 years ago?
Yes. And the dem we have running for gov wants neither a coal or nuclear plants.
|
|
|
|
|
RE: China drills for oil off shore of Cuba - 6/10/2008 1:32:57 PM
|
|
|
blessedinnyc
Posts: 1672
Joined: 10/12/2007
Status: offline
|
quote:
ORIGINAL: colliefan
plow the fields
sow the fields
reap the fields
get the produce to the various production fields
get what it produced to the markets
get the customers to the market
drive the police cars, ambulences, fire engines, school bus, mail truck, etc
how is wind to be used as pavement
how is wind to be used in making cell phones, IPODs, carpets, CDs, etc.
The argument is that of all liberals, full of hot air!
Hydrogen via ammonia- very simple. Ammonia has on the order of the same energy density as gasoline, and is made up of two things we can get easily: nitrogen and water. Ammonia can be produced and stored while the wind is blowing.
In fact, ammonia can be burnt in most internal combustion engines with some minor modifications.
quote:
And people were spinning that lie thirty years ago along with the lie we were heading into a new ice age! It is precisly to the refusal to drill for ANY new oil that we are in the crisis we find today.
I'm not claiming anything about global warming. I own land in the midwest, and if Florida and half the south go underwater, it means more money for me, because people will have to build their homes further north. On top of that, the Great Lakes will become a freshwater Gulf of Mexico, making it an excellent resort destination.
I'm claiming that we're running out of oil. You agree we have a finite supply, right? Peak oil just means that oil production is going to hit an all-time-high and then go into terminal decline as we have a harder time of finding and producing dwindling oil resources.
quote:
Andour educational system has produced enough mind-numbed morons who believe it is all the fault of those evil oil companies! Yes, we need to explore for new alternatives, but not at the cost of crashing the economy!
Actually, according to a recent study, fewer Americans blame Big Oil for high oil prices than ever before. Some blame speculators, but many blame what I believe is the root problem- consumption.
|
|
|
|
|
RE: China drills for oil off shore of Cuba - 6/10/2008 1:35:56 PM
|
|
|
blessedinnyc
Posts: 1672
Joined: 10/12/2007
Status: offline
|
quote:
ORIGINAL: rlj
Does everyone realize that the last new nuclear power plant built in the US was built over 30 years ago?
Technically, the last license was applied for 30 years ago. I believe the last plant came online only 15 years ago.
And many closed nuclear plants- particularly ones under the TVA- are coming back online.
And many new licenses are being applied for right now.
|
|
|
|
|
RE: China drills for oil off shore of Cuba - 6/10/2008 4:42:52 PM
|
|
|
colliefan
Posts: 2531
Joined: 4/12/2005
From: Raleigh, NC
Status: offline
|
You have NOT answered my question! How is wind going to power the vehicles needed in the operation I mentioned. How is wind going to power an airplane?
How is wind going to be used to make the following:
link one
link two
|
|
|
|
|
RE: China drills for oil off shore of Cuba - 6/10/2008 4:53:36 PM
|
|
|
colliefan
Posts: 2531
Joined: 4/12/2005
From: Raleigh, NC
Status: offline
|
And don't give me the liberal drivel about the USA being 5% of the world population yet comsumes 25% of its resources. The question that begs to be asked is what have we
Done
with those resources.
For one, we supply 20% of the world's corn!
|
|
|
|
|
RE: China drills for oil off shore of Cuba - 6/10/2008 5:15:19 PM
|
|
|
blessedinnyc
Posts: 1672
Joined: 10/12/2007
Status: offline
|
quote:
ORIGINAL: colliefan
You have NOT answered my question! How is wind going to power the vehicles needed in the operation I mentioned. How is wind going to power an airplane?
How is wind going to be used to make the following:
link one
link two
OK, let me make it easier to understand:
Wind energy->Mechanical energy in rotating turbine blades->electricity via a generator->hydrogen via electrolysis->( Ammonia via N2+3H2->2 NH3)->Fuel that can substitute for gasoline with minor modifications to your engine.
As for asphalt, the Fischer-Tropsch process allows us to generate syncrude using CTL- which can be used for asphalt and all those other petrochemicals.
But let's assume we want to remain totally green. Fischer-Tropsch doesn't care whether the input is natural gas, coal, or anything else- just as long as it generates CO and we can get H2 out of it. So all we really need is some H2 from the wind turbines and some CO from burning wood. Petrochemicals require maybe 1 million barrels per day of oil at the very most, and we can easily meet these with biofuels.
< Message edited by blessedinnyc -- 6/10/2008 6:16:37 PM >
|
|
|
|
|
Name calling doesn't change the economic reality. - 6/10/2008 5:38:56 PM
|
|
|
blessedinnyc
Posts: 1672
Joined: 10/12/2007
Status: offline
|
quote:
And you and your fellow reds would have us live like this [link to some far-left site. Shall I dredge up stuff from the far-right?]
It seems that your rhetoric is starting to verge on the desperate. As a Chicago-school leaning economic libertarian, I am making humble observations about the market and in turn getting called a commy by someone who has less to do with the markets than I do. Since people who are running out of ideas tend to resort to ad-hominems, why don't we all just fast-forward through this part and just agree that $4 gas:
-Won't go down by more than $0.25 if the environuts get out of the way so we can open an extra 0.2% of the world's reserves for production.
-Can be blamed on foreign governments a whole lot more than it can be blamed on environmentalists or Big Oil.
-Is really a result of fundamental geological limits.
-Can be fixed by reducing our consumption of oil and transitioning to new energy sources.
-May be replaced with energy from solar, nuclear, wind, and wood if you go on what the market seems to indicate.
In any case, based on my experience working in capital markets, I can laugh off the charge of commy. But please don't let your delusions about the market screw up your retirement investments.
quote:
And don't give me the liberal drivel about the USA being 5% of the world population yet comsumes 25% of its resources. The question that begs to be asked is what have we
Done
with those resources.
For one, we supply 20% of the world's corn!
That's true. We are more efficient, in terms of GDP/gallon, than many countries. But the good news here is that better energy efficiency in the US lets us compete a whole lot better against China.
If you think Bush was right about free-trade with China, higher energy efficiency in the US will help vindicate him. Why? If American workers cost $10/hour but only require 1/2 gallon/hour of fuel to make a product while the Chinese cost $1/hour and require four gallons, America is a cheaper country to manufacture in with high oil prices. That means more jobs and more growth at home.
So what's wrong with improving energy efficiency if it brings jobs to the US?
< Message edited by blessedinnyc -- 6/10/2008 6:07:39 PM >
|
|
|
|
|
RE: China drills for oil off shore of Cuba - 6/10/2008 5:41:35 PM
|
|
|
jkdjr25
Posts: 726
Joined: 2/19/2008
From: Michigan
Status: offline
|
Collie, you need to calm down.
We're not advocating socialism in encouraging research into alternative fuels. In fact there's one right now that's used in Brazil that we could start using that would take a huge burden off of the oil market, and that option is sugarcane based ethanol. It's more efficient, cheaper than corn ethanol and would do exactly what we need it to. The problem is that our government has an embargo on foreign sugar to protect our own market.
Lift the embargo and start importing the sugarcane ethanol, we need this fuel as a back up source of power. Look into hydrogen powered cars, invest in researching the use of amonia or methane as alternative fuel sources.
The options are only as limited as your imagination. We're offering solutions based on a desire to be good caretakers and ones that could prove to be highly lucrative on the open market. You're the one who's responding with name calling and false accusations of socialism.
_____________________________
I reject your reality and subsitute my own.- Adam Savage, Mythbusters
|
|
|
|
|
RE: China drills for oil off shore of Cuba - 6/10/2008 5:45:45 PM
|
|
|
darren.beene
Posts: 26
Joined: 9/14/2007
Status: offline
|
Colliefan is absolutley right own!!! I get so dadblamed tired a hearing about how us Amercans use to much energy compaired to other places in the world. Well, duh! WE IS AMERCANS AND WE NEED IT to run all are industrys and fuel are vehicals to transport things so we can ship em all over. Besides, are country is a heckuva lot bigger than them dinky foo foo Eurpeean countrys. Then all them African and Asian countrys were they dont drive just dont need the same amount a oil that we do. Besides if it woodnt for all are genarossity and industry a lotta them folks wood still be back in the Stone Age. If they is raw materals just setting around with no body else using them, us AMERCANS can find a dang good use for them!!!
|
|
|
|
|
RE: China drills for oil off shore of Cuba - 6/10/2008 6:10:43 PM
|
|
|
blessedinnyc
Posts: 1672
Joined: 10/12/2007
Status: offline
|
quote:
ORIGINAL: darren.beene
Colliefan is absolutley right own!!! I get so dadblamed tired a hearing about how us Amercans use to much energy compaired to other places in the world. Well, duh! WE IS AMERCANS AND WE NEED IT to run all are industrys and fuel are vehicals to transport things so we can ship em all over. Besides, are country is a heckuva lot bigger than them dinky foo foo Eurpeean countrys. Then all them African and Asian countrys were they dont drive just dont need the same amount a oil that we do. Besides if it woodnt for all are genarossity and industry a lotta them folks wood still be back in the Stone Age. If they is raw materals just setting around with no body else using them, us AMERCANS can find a dang good use for them!!!
Ok, that's fine, but don't complain that oil is too expensive if your argument is that we create more value and produce more, because then we should earn more so we should be able to afford more.
|
|
|
|
|
RE: China drills for oil off shore of Cuba - 6/10/2008 11:34:12 PM
|
|
|
ta_mosquito
Posts: 11004
Joined: 3/31/2005
From: from MN, now in Ontario :D
Status: offline
|
MODERATOR'S NOTE :: ATTENTION PLEASE
I have deleted several posts for harassing other posters and a couple for responding to the deleted posts (i.e. housekeeping). I am now in the process of sending PM's to those who broke TOS. If you do not receive a PM, you may conclude that your post was removed in cleanup and wasn't a violation.
Thank you!
Tricia
Forums Moderator
Please do not reply to this message within the forums or chat.
Please email Community@salemwebnetwork.com with questions, comments, or concerns.
Please do not send me PMs regarding this message.
|
|
|
|
|
RE: China drills for oil off shore of Cuba - 6/11/2008 8:26:33 AM
|
|
|
mapachito13
Posts: 2024
Joined: 10/1/2007
Status: online
|
I saw the price of gas this morning, $4.55 for 87 octane! We'll probably see $5.00 by 4th of July when we celebrate our political independence and lament our oil dependence!
_____________________________
Three Nails to protect us!
And Justice for all!
Peace Sells....But Who's Buying!
|
|
|
|
 New Messages |
 No New Messages |
 Hot Topic w/ New Messages |
 Hot Topic w/o New Messages |
 Locked w/ New Messages |
 Locked w/o New Messages |
|
 Post New Thread
Reply to Message
Post New Poll
Submit Vote
Delete My Own Post
Delete My Own Thread
Rate Posts |
|
|
Forum Tools
Printable Version
