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RE: Allah supports Creationism. - 7/20/2008 2:46:36 AM
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scutus
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Can you edit your post so that you replace the long url with something shorter?
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Suo enim quisque studio maxime ducitur.
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RE: Allah supports Creationism. - 7/20/2008 3:39:12 AM
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Aristocrat
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what would be the sense now that it's been quoted. Is it a problem for you?
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I find it odd that ID proponents call evolution materialistic and then take the materialistic approach to finding the ID or Creator.
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RE: Allah supports Creationism. - 7/21/2008 2:47:43 AM
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scutus
Posts: 451
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quote:
what would be the sense now that it's been quoted. That's a shame.
quote:
Is it a problem for you? Yes, it's annoying to scroll to read the posts.
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Suo enim quisque studio maxime ducitur.
—Cicero, De Finibus, 5.5
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RE: Allah supports Creationism. - 7/21/2008 1:31:27 PM
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Jhud
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What is the point of this thread?
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Jack
“I mean to live my life an obedient man, but obedient to God, subservient to the wisdom of my ancestors; never to the authority of political truths arrived at yesterday at the voting booth”
William F. Buckley Jr. 1925-2008
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RE: Allah supports Creationism. - 7/21/2008 2:42:48 PM
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Jhud
Posts: 7376
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quote:
1.) Ignorance is a cross-cultural phenomenon:
2). More evidence against the idea of Intelligent Design.
Is a Muslim believed in evolution, would that constitute evidence against evolution?
_____________________________
Jack
“I mean to live my life an obedient man, but obedient to God, subservient to the wisdom of my ancestors; never to the authority of political truths arrived at yesterday at the voting booth”
William F. Buckley Jr. 1925-2008
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RE: Allah supports Creationism. - 7/21/2008 2:52:52 PM
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drj11
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quote:
ORIGINAL: Jhud
What is the point of this thread?
That Muslim creationism deserves equal time in the classroom?
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RE: Allah supports Creationism. - 7/21/2008 2:55:04 PM
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Jhud
Posts: 7376
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quote:
That Muslim creationism deserves equal time in the classroom?
I believe in most Muslim countries it has the only time; very similar to atheist countries in this respect.
_____________________________
Jack
“I mean to live my life an obedient man, but obedient to God, subservient to the wisdom of my ancestors; never to the authority of political truths arrived at yesterday at the voting booth”
William F. Buckley Jr. 1925-2008
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RE: Allah supports Creationism. - 7/21/2008 3:59:30 PM
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cow451
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quote:
ORIGINAL: Jhud
quote:
1.) Ignorance is a cross-cultural phenomenon:
2). More evidence against the idea of Intelligent Design.
Is a Muslim believed in evolution, would that constitute evidence against evolution?
No. The point is that Muslim and Christian creationism are equally poor versions of science and religion, in the scholarly sense.
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Wenn Sie so intelligent sind, warum Sie hier sind?
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RE: Allah supports Creationism. - 7/21/2008 4:03:26 PM
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Jhud
Posts: 7376
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quote:
No. The point is that Muslim and Christian creationism are equally poor versions of science and religion, in the scholarly sense.
So if a Muslim's belief in evolution does not constitute evidence against evolution, how could a belief in Intelligent Design (or something like it) constitute "evidence against the idea of Intelligent Design."?
_____________________________
Jack
“I mean to live my life an obedient man, but obedient to God, subservient to the wisdom of my ancestors; never to the authority of political truths arrived at yesterday at the voting booth”
William F. Buckley Jr. 1925-2008
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RE: Allah supports Creationism. - 7/21/2008 4:25:36 PM
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drj11
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quote:
ORIGINAL: Jhud
quote:
That Muslim creationism deserves equal time in the classroom?
I believe in most Muslim countries it has the only time; very similar to atheist countries in this respect.
I bet those atheist countries only teach math in math class too. Crazy.
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RE: Allah supports Creationism. - 7/21/2008 4:33:44 PM
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Jhud
Posts: 7376
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quote:
I bet those atheist countries only teach math in math class too. Crazy.
So what are you saying - the teaching of math by communists in no way reflects badly on the concept of math?
_____________________________
Jack
“I mean to live my life an obedient man, but obedient to God, subservient to the wisdom of my ancestors; never to the authority of political truths arrived at yesterday at the voting booth”
William F. Buckley Jr. 1925-2008
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RE: Allah supports Creationism. - 7/21/2008 4:42:10 PM
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drj11
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quote:
ORIGINAL: Jhud
quote:
I bet those atheist countries only teach math in math class too. Crazy.
So what are you saying - the teaching of math by communists in no way reflects badly on the concept of math?
Of course not. Math is the same whether your communist, bhuddist, christian or japanese. Evolution is also the same. Creationism isnt, so it's not really a valid comparison.
I don't think Muslims teaching their brand of creationism reflects badly on the concept of creationism. I don't see how its possible to make creationism any worse than it already is. It reflects badly upon these Muslims who advocate it, just like the creationism reflects badly upon Christians who advocate it.
But lets hear how those who would defend teaching creationism in schools would react to Muslim's attempting to insert their brand of it in schools along side it?
edit: Plus this thread is amusing if for nothing else than the general xenophobia regarding Muslim's and the similarities here are sure to make a few quite uncomfortable.
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RE: Allah supports Creationism. - 7/21/2008 4:51:23 PM
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Aristocrat
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If I could remember how to do that, I would have shortened it for you. Sorry.
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I find it odd that ID proponents call evolution materialistic and then take the materialistic approach to finding the ID or Creator.
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RE: Allah supports Creationism. - 7/21/2008 4:53:41 PM
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Aristocrat
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quote:
ORIGINAL: Jhud
quote:
1.) Ignorance is a cross-cultural phenomenon:
2). More evidence against the idea of Intelligent Design.
Is a Muslim believed in evolution, would that constitute evidence against evolution?
Of course not, Jhud. Think about what you just asked. Scientists from all over the world and from every walk support, research and teach the Theory of Evolution. There is no religious concept in science that should offend anyones' beliefs.
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I find it odd that ID proponents call evolution materialistic and then take the materialistic approach to finding the ID or Creator.
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RE: Allah supports Creationism. - 7/21/2008 5:17:07 PM
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Jhud
Posts: 7376
Joined: 4/11/2005
From: Lake Wobegon
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quote:
Of course not. Math is the same whether your communist, bhuddist, christian or japanese. Evolution is also the same. Creationism isnt, so it's not really a valid comparison.
I don't think Muslims teaching their brand of creationism reflects badly on the concept of creationism. I don't see how its possible to make creationism any worse than it already is. It reflects badly upon these Muslims who advocate it, just like the creationism reflects badly upon Christians who advocate it.
But lets hear how those who would defend teaching creationism in schools would react to Muslim's attempting to insert their brand of it in schools along side it?
edit: Plus this thread is amusing if for nothing else than the general xenophobia regarding Muslim's and the similarities here are sure to make a few quite uncomfortable
Considering you called a Muslim thinker ‘ignorant’ within the second post of the thread, it would seem you are the one promoting xenophobia against Muslims. In fact the primary argument by secularists on here seems to be:
- Muslims are ignorant, because they believe ‘Muslim-y things’
- Muslims believe in creationism
- Those who believe in creationism are ignorant.
Ironically, I think most Christians would have no problem with presenting non-sectarian evidence for the existence of a designer, which would presumably be equally satisfactory to a Muslim. Indeed, a number of Christians have adopted the Kalaam Cosmological Argument as a proof of the existence of God – an argument derived from an Islamic dialectic. So it isn’t the Christians who are intellectual bigots in this respect
_____________________________
Jack
“I mean to live my life an obedient man, but obedient to God, subservient to the wisdom of my ancestors; never to the authority of political truths arrived at yesterday at the voting booth”
William F. Buckley Jr. 1925-2008
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RE: Allah supports Creationism. - 7/21/2008 5:18:42 PM
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Jhud
Posts: 7376
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From: Lake Wobegon
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quote:
Of course not, Jhud. Think about what you just asked. Scientists from all over the world and from every walk support, research and teach the Theory of Evolution. There is no religious concept in science that should offend anyones' beliefs.
Even if this is the case, what is the point of your post?
_____________________________
Jack
“I mean to live my life an obedient man, but obedient to God, subservient to the wisdom of my ancestors; never to the authority of political truths arrived at yesterday at the voting booth”
William F. Buckley Jr. 1925-2008
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RE: Allah supports Creationism. - 7/21/2008 5:27:57 PM
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Aristocrat
Posts: 907
Joined: 8/3/2007
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quote:
ORIGINAL: Jhud
quote:
Of course not, Jhud. Think about what you just asked. Scientists from all over the world and from every walk support, research and teach the Theory of Evolution. There is no religious concept in science that should offend anyones' beliefs.
Even if this is the case, what is the point of your post?
The point is that Muslims wish to form an alliance with Christians for religious reasons.
Heres more:
http://www.islamonline.net/english/Contemporary/2004/09/article02.shtml
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I find it odd that ID proponents call evolution materialistic and then take the materialistic approach to finding the ID or Creator.
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RE: Allah supports Creationism. - 7/21/2008 5:34:28 PM
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Jhud
Posts: 7376
Joined: 4/11/2005
From: Lake Wobegon
Status: online
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quote:
The point is that Muslims wish to form an alliance with Christians for religious reasons.
Heres more:
http://www.islamonline.net/english/Contemporary/2004/09/article02.shtml
Well, Muslims, Jews, Christians, and any other theistic belief have common cause in resisting overt imposition of Secularism. I am not sure why this would be suprising or particularly controversial. It's also not particularly new news as the article dates to '04.
_____________________________
Jack
“I mean to live my life an obedient man, but obedient to God, subservient to the wisdom of my ancestors; never to the authority of political truths arrived at yesterday at the voting booth”
William F. Buckley Jr. 1925-2008
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RE: Allah supports Creationism. - 7/21/2008 6:10:08 PM
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Jhud
Posts: 7376
Joined: 4/11/2005
From: Lake Wobegon
Status: online
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quote:
You missed my heavily-veiled attempt at humor. Examples of human ignorance would be "arguments against Intelligent Design". As Letterman would attest, if you have to explain it, it isn't funny.
My humor detector is so unreliable on a Monday. Sorry!
_____________________________
Jack
“I mean to live my life an obedient man, but obedient to God, subservient to the wisdom of my ancestors; never to the authority of political truths arrived at yesterday at the voting booth”
William F. Buckley Jr. 1925-2008
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RE: Allah supports Creationism. - 7/21/2008 6:47:58 PM
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drj11
Posts: 632
Joined: 3/29/2008
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quote:
ORIGINAL: Jhud
Considering you called a Muslim thinker ‘ignorant’ within the second post of the thread, it would seem you are the one promoting xenophobia against Muslims. In fact the primary argument by secularists on here seems to be:
You cant have creationism without ignorance. Muslim, Christian, Hindu or Jew... the religion is irrelevant. Renown 'thinker' or not, creationism is ignorance.
quote:
Ironically, I think most Christians would have no problem with presenting non-sectarian evidence for the existence of a designer, which would presumably be equally satisfactory to a Muslim. Indeed, a number of Christians have adopted the Kalaam Cosmological Argument as a proof of the existence of God – an argument derived from an Islamic dialectic. So it isn’t the Christians who are intellectual bigots in this respect
Those are some mighty think rose colored glasses there.
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